Frostwrath  

 

with the new pure melee class changes, I dont think you pallys and SKs are gonna be the main agro holders anymore, I think warriors'll be out agroin ya...quick

Tanking in PoN PoI PoD is one thing. . .Tanking a raid mob like for instnace this dragon is another thing. Warriors are tanks cause they have more HPs. You need more time to get those CH's off.

triggered by melee.....been nerfed unfortunately

There are many situations in which a SK should have aggro, though you wouldn't yet know as you've never been in any of 'em... SK's do get the job of managing the aggro; if a mob starts to ping pong, the SK should be the one grabbing aggro and then getting it back to the MT. If a mob is poorly placed (I.E. the rogues can't get in position to BS) the SK is often the one in charge of moving it. In some circumstances where MT's much be switched for defensive, the SK will tank for a bit untill the new MT can build up enough taunt. On some mobs, an SK will be the MT. Being able to control aggro so well, SKs make great MTs for mobs which do not require defensive. They can have fairly comperable melee stats to a warrior and are able to keep the mob on target well. I MT Icewell raids all the time. The mobs are not such as to require defensive, and I can handle them as well as many warriors. Against uber mobs, warriors should tank due to defensive, otherwise, there is no reason to assume that SKs (or paladins, though more often SKs) can't take the heat. SKs are great at keeping things in order and take the beating when necessary... they are sorta like the enchanters of un-mezzable mobs.

One word ... MORON! even with Mrylokars Dagger or say Primal (higher dmg dly, but the proc induces quite a bit of aggro) that if you are out taunting your tank you have a problem ... or a sh*tty tank. As a paladin I could easily hold taunt in groups with 2 rogues all you need to do is chain cast stuns/flash of light. As for getting aggro as a rogue ... try making an evade hotkey, its awesome. Even with 1100 ac and 3.5k hp in a normal group as a rogue getting aggro sux, so just evade a few times stay at max range, and if you really need to turn off attack a few seconds and evade 1 time like that to let tank regain aggro

just my 2cp

OK this is a SHD/PAL weapon, we aren't talking
about rogue weapons. Yes that is true about the
dmg 15 and the dly 13 with the RageBringer in
off-hand,and that Mryloker's Dagger in primary,
but still, can't we get back to the point of this
weapon instead of other stuff (such as weapons,
armor, etc)????? Please!
BTW she looks like Trakanon.

WOW and dont forget to add that a WIZARD can get himself on top of the hatelist of a mob that quads and flurry for 1000 damage per hit if he just casts his spells fast enough!!!!
Would he want that? no, only if he is a dumbass like you are :(
a rogue that constantly outtaunts the MainTank should look for another class to play as he is messing mob placement up and ( in the best case) gets killed instantly

Is a rogue the tauntmaster? Where you live man?

1. You can't outtaun a mob against a well equiped sk, pally or warrior without a few succesfull backstabs, that recommanded we keep the mob in a right postion for you at last for a rounds.
2. We have spells to move up on the mob's hatelist if we need it and keep agro or lost it up to the situation. We SKs have a good area spell with low mana cost and castingtime to "agro - taunt" all mobs around us /and we have AC and HP to do it, NOT like a rogue/. Where can a rogue "taunt" more than one mob if needed? Agroed rogue is dead, or just drains the cleric's mana for nothing via the kid like HP and AC.
3. At last I just hope, once your party will leave the agro on you, you "tauntmaster". *grins*

Edited, Tue Dec 18 06:56:45 2001

First... Nice sword =P

Now for the cat to come out of the bag:

Sks can tank non-uber mobs better than warriors in many raid and non raid situations. The reason is simple, and I'll just use two different examples from two different guilds I raided with back to back to illustrate what I see a lot in raids where the MA isn't exactly dueling primals.

Raid #1 Hate, 57 SK tanking on vanilla mobs, and warriors sequencing defensive on the named. Sk has decent gear, but not stuff you'd put on your dream character. AC had to be over 1200, and he was using a Noc Blade/shield combo. Monk pulls, Sk pops with arrow, darkness coming in, three fast debuffs, and then assist call (some serious mana feeding was going on obviously). No one died all night, although the monk had a couple of close calls. The assist call came about ten seconds after contact, and the MA had no problem at all keeping the mobs on him.

Raid #2 Fear (next day), 58 Warrior MA for everyone. He has decent gear, but once again, this is a mid range guild, so he's duel wielding Lammys, and has AC around 1150 or better (guessing on both since I didn't ask, but know a bit about equipment). Pally pulling (go figure), warrior engages, and we wait for the assist call... And wait...... and wait. 30 or more seconds to the assist seems like an eternity. The main group cleric gets wiped out 3 times trying to keep the guy alive, and when she doesn't get agro, some unlucky rogue who gets a nice BS early usually does. We get a full wipe out late in the night when the two chanters get the crap beat out of them in the indeterminable wait on a 5 mob pull. It drove me crazy, but then I had a great time FD for over an hour.

The reason these threads drive me nuts is that the end game has wormed it's way into everyone else's entertainment product due to people expanding a simple truism (that only warriors can tank uber mobs) to the other 99.9% of monsters in the game. I hate seeing posts by players saying "well, I'd never tank my lvl 24 SK if there was a 20+ warrior in the group" /boggle and /sigh.

I know clerics who swear by well played SKs and even *gasp* Rangers in xp groups because they know if they get beat on, it's probably going to be five seconds or less before the mob is off. They also know that on xp mobs, Rangers can tank just fine too. I've met quite a few chanters who have developed quite an affinity for both hybrid classes as well.

I'm not going to put my SK up against Cazic Thule tomorrow, but let's get real. The mobs who quad for 1200 are far and few between in this game. I don't begrudge Warriors at all for defensive. It's a kick ass skill that has kept groups I've been in alive. I just get irritated with the "a Pally should never tank a Gnoll Pup if a warrior is around" BS. The game is more flexible than that.

While the kind of uber a guild would need to be to get this is above a duel Lammy wielding MA, and so the lucky Pally/SK who got it wouldn't be considering anything other than Harper's Index during pulls, this thread has gotten beyond this type of drop =)

Toddles

Oh totally! I (45 ranger) can be grouped with any number of warriors, and all it takes is 1 snare to take at least 7 or 8 hits from critter X. Thats plenty of time for the cleric or whatever to get out of harms way. We usually don't do that kind of thing because it can get very messy...

Paladin's can taunt off Warriors with just taunt. When I was in my high 40's and until now lv54 I have always been able to taunt the mob off a warrior a couple lvls higher than me with just one or two clicks of the taunt button. No spell casting or anything. Now I don't like taunting off a Warrior unless needed but I will do it everyonce in awhile to add a little excitement :)

Zedrique Caelicola
Lv54 Cavalier
Bertox

Not proc'd, it is triggered, ie: right clickable. All i can say is....Wow :)

A paladins job is to protect others.
If you are getting the crapola out of you with 1bubble of hp left, then the cleric yells "Complete Healing to %t", well, you better cross your fingers. (ya, they usually say "bad lag" to make your corpse run more interesting). We dont deal as much damage as you do, nor do we have as much hp as you. Now if i buff myself, i WILL have probably have more HP than you AND AC, makes you think about all that hard earned pp you spent on high AC armor you bought. My job is to keep mobs perma-stunned. At level 49 in Karnors castle i can put in almost 10 stuns per battle with 1 warrrior / cleric/ chantre /paladin /rogue /druid. If you think about it, each Stun is only takes 1.5secs to cast and lasts up to 4seconds (according to eq.realmcasters.com, and we also have Holy Might which stuns mob up to 6 seconds as well as direct damage for 60damage, and we also have thunder of karana which stuns a mob for up to 6 seconds as well as steals their mana. That is about 15 consecutive seconds for a cleric or another healer to heal you, and fire about 2 seconds right after each other. No other class has 3 stun spells memmed at level 49. Now imagine if you had 2, or 3 of us paladins in your group, im sure you've heard of chain stunning. Who cares for SOW, we are stun pullers (not sure about you but at these levels we already have travellers boots or Jboots). Not to mention that we heal for 300hp at these levels so cleric can save mana for those complete healings. We are defensive fighters, you are offensive, thus i have seen several paladins with outrageous AC. You do your job on hitting things and we make sure that you get hit as little as possible, cuz if you havent grouped with properly used paladins, you would already know that we already own agro (yes rogues/rangers/wizards actually own it, but then the mob owns you immediately) without even taunting. Although unbuffed you rule with higher HP, what is another 100 or 300 hp more gonna do for you at mobs who hit 130 or so, other than let you get 1 or 2 steps closer to zone? Each fight i do at least 6 stuns of various spells in, costing mana of course, but this way warrior/monk can pull while i let my regen do its work or use my 160hp heals from Deepwater Helm (or heal myself), or let cleric use Celestial Healing on me, this means less downtime.
Yes you are better than us at dealing damage, 2nd to Rogue (non oomer damage that is), period. You cannot do any type of crowd control (lull, calm, soothe, root, enstill), you cannot immediately take a mob off someone (our line of stun spells), and you benifit the groups downtime by 0 percent by not helping mana go any faster (healing others), or casting heals, and you cant AC/HP buff anything, and you cant revive or do exp rezzes to help with downtime as well. Note i didn't even mention Lay Hands as it is used too much. How many times have I heard "I'll never talk bad about Paladins after that Lay Hands"... 1500+hp heal, no delay, maybe more, but thats what I was told i healed for last time when it really looked bad for our group as Monk had a bad pull trying to zone and FD not working with 5 mobs on him... if we use it on ourselves, so much for your hp more than us thing. If played right, you will get rarely hit, nor will anyone else in group, and you will get the most out of your attacks.

My guild has 5 or 6 of these, so its not that hard to get. And yes they all went to pallys

Its for paladins and shadowknights, they cant duel wield.