New Changes on the Horizon

I received two letters today from SOE regarding the new changes being implemented in the game. The first was the one Quemn posted yesterday, so here's the second. It's definitely something you should read through, as there are some significant changes listed here. Letter #2: Fri Mar 15 2002, Changes/Anniversary Detail As promised, we would like to explain in more detail some of the changes that you'll be seeing in EverQuest. Some of these changes are already available on the Test Server and will be arriving on Live servers just in time for EverQuest's third anniversary. Others you may expect to find on Test in the coming weeks, which we hope to make available to everyone soon afterward. For those new to EverQuest, as well as our mid-level players:
  • The need to sit down and stare at the spellbook to regain mana has been removed at all levels. (Sitting down and having Meditation skill are still required.)
  • When starting a new character for the first time, it can take quite some time to get into that class' core abilities. In some cases, the style of gameplay needs to shift dramatically. That being the case, we've accelerated the rate at which people gain experience up to level ten.
  • In addition, undue frustration can occur during these youthful times. Traumatic events such as losing a corpse and not knowing where to find it or how to retrieve it can be quite the ordeal. With that in mind, we've changed the way that death works below level ten. Characters level nine and under who die will appear at their bind point with all of their equipment intact. (A short-lived corpse will still be left at the site of the disaster to allow the player to receive a resurrection.)
  • Experience gained in dungeons designed for players level 30 and under will be increased. For many people, there is nothing more satisfying in EverQuest than adventuring in dungeons. By giving people the tools to help them succeed earlier, and rewards to match, we hope that more players will discover why many people feel this way.
  • In the spirit of getting characters into more dangerous and rewarding situations, earlier, the following spell lines have been altered to make them easier to use and more widely available, across more level ranges.
  • * Resurrection, for Clerics and Paladins. * Summon Corpse, for Necromancers and Shadowknights. * Succor/Evacuate, for Druids and Wizards
  • The bind points of starting characters will more closely match the areas they are already familiar with. (No more getting lost as new characters die in town, only to show up someplace outside.)
  • New characters now start with considerably more food and drink.
  • After applying advanced mathematcs, the commonly known "hell-level" xperience gain effect in levels 30, 35, 40, and 45 has been largely done away with. Further, the "post-hell-level" experience loss in levels 31, 36, 41, and 46 was driven from the face of Norrath as well.
  • For all EverQuest players:
  • Rumors abound that Bristlebane, God of Mischief, for reasons of his own design, has infused the Gnome and Halfling races with new potential professions. (Whether this is a blessing or a curse has yet to be decided.)
  • The long-requested global chat channels are well on their way. We'll be supporting player-created chat channels for raids, for friends, for total strangers - Anything you'd like to use them for. Expect a documentation update (eqmanual_supplement.doc in your EverQuest directory) explaining how to use these soon.
  • We've cleaned up what happens while you're zoning. The days of a frozen screen full of blurry text may well be over, forever. (The days of losing /tells, /guild chat, and group messages while zoning will hopefully be heading out the door behind them.)
  • While we have aimed to support armor/skin layer tinting on the majority of video cards, some of the abandoned video cards that are still used to play EverQuest unfortunately do not have the power to handle this feature. With that in mind, we will soon be implementing a switch that will allow players to enable armor/skin tinting at their discretion. (Stay tuned to a patch message, coming soon.)
  • The last item we'd like to mention is a brief update on caster and priest rebalancing. (Please note that the balancing act is still going on, across the board. We wanted to update you on the progress we've made so far.)
  • Expect to see the first of the Focus Items for spell casters and spell-casting hybrids soon. We will leave the specifics to you to discover, but rest assured that useful and exciting focus items are making their way into the game as we speak.
  • Enchanters' Memory Blur line, and aspects of Rapture and Glamour of Kintaz have been improved.
  • The grouping requirement for the Translocate series of spells has been removed.
  • Clerics' Smite line has been improved.
  • The Post-50 Lich line for Necromancers has been redistributed.
  • Necromancers' Levant and Skin of the Shadow have been changed to allow them to be used any time of the day.
  • Necromancers' Quivering Veil of Xarn has been improved.
  • Many of the caster balance changes to date have been made with feedback from the dedicated players of these classes, both from EMails and message boards. We're grateful for the time and effort that has been put into many well-reasoned comments we've received. Thank you for helping us make our world, yours. - The EverQuest Team

    Comments

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    New stuff
    # Mar 16 2002 at 3:27 PM Rating: Default
    Okay, my mother board got fried out a little while ago, while I wait for my new one to come in. I use this pos pc to check this site everyone once in a while. Some of the new thing they listed are not very clear to me. First off, is it true that hell lvls are now gone? And second, I have lvl 30 cleric, what of all this exp rez early and better smite line? Are they saying that my revive will return some exp? and smite/wrath do more damage or something?
    #Anonymous, Posted: Mar 16 2002 at 2:17 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) i really dont think that hell lvls should be taken out. 30 and 35 didnt seem so bad, but 40 DID help me learn to grp and get along with ppl. it helps u prepare even if it doesnt seem like it. This may just be to my benefit but 40 and 45 i quested my butt off for all i have. I still have almost no money in the bank, just my friends.
    RE: hell lvls
    # Mar 16 2002 at 3:06 PM Rating: Default
    Hell levels should not be taken out I believe either, maybe the exp difference won't chance between 1 - 50, but the time you take away from grinding cause it gets boring could be used for blacksmithing, tailoring, questing. Making it so the hell levels are gone and making little difference between levels will get your high lvl peopel without any skill who haven't enjoyed the game through quests as they have just grinded the whole way.
    questions
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:03 PM Rating: Default
    i would just like to know how giving res skills to lower lvl players will increase dungeon raid's?

    im not even close to a high lvl char, the best i have is a 25 warrior, and a 22 shammy, but from what i have read here and other places, most dungeons that i would want to raid are full of mobs that would swat me like a fly. now i dont know all the zones in the game, in fact the only time ive ever been out of antonica at all was my few weeks in LoIo so i dont know what zones are conciderd dungeons,

    but in Black burrough, and permafrost i didnt see any thing to hard about fighting in these zones. granted i couldnt go deep into permafrost, we mostly set just inside the zone line and pulled gobbys, and ran like hell from the deep pulls that the high lvls did on there vox raid's, but my point is i didnt learn anything about dungeons by camping just inside the zone line and running like hell from mobs that no ammount of lvl 20 chars could kill , rez or no.

    and black burrough its so full of people , and the mobs take no skill (meaning you dont have to know how to play your class to group effectavily peeps just mele mobs to death) at all to kill, that i didnt learn nothing about raiding there either)

    i have a friend that has a 52 cleric and i can get a rez any time i ask for it, but i never have. i can see wanting a rez if your lvl 59 and have spent months getting what exp you have, but at lvl 24 i can do the whole level in a day at most, and if i am so incompitant that i die repeatedly then maybe i should choose an "easyer" class to play.

    as far as learning your class go's i find that a little reserch on sight's like this one go a long way twards helping that goal. i once grouped with a warrior when i played my shammy that was lvl 23 and his taunt skill was 10. now how do you get to lvl 22 with a warrior and only have a 10 taunt skill? answer? your an idiot thats how. and no ammount of dungeon raiding is going to help you understand your class's roll, if you dont grasp the basics or take the time to learn from outside sources.

    my ONLY gripe with this game as it is, is the ammount of down time wating to heal, or med your mana back. i used to spend 10 minuts at a pop staring at my spell book meding, add that to 5 or 6 minuts to take down a mob, and a 3 or 4 minuts to find one in the first place and your getting one kill every 20 minuts. now at lvl 21 in LoIo i was getting about 1/4 blue from a kill so that adds up to 100 kills to lvl, thats 2000 minuts to lvl thats not adding in time to get supplys and sell loot, or any of the hundreds of other things you do in a session of game play.

    i know im talking about soloing, and with my tank its gone alot faster in groups since i dont solo at all now (by choice not need) but it still can take up to 2 hrs to get a good group, and its hard as hell to keep one. you just trade one set of problems for another one, and you STILL have to wate for casters to med even IN a group, its all a ballancing act, and some classes just get cut out. i thing that VI should take Druids, and Shammys and classes that dont fall into group rolls with ease and make them so there geared more twards soloing than grouping. like faster mana regen rate because wile i enjoy a good group and understand that to kill really powerfull mobs ill need to group, i dont think it should be required at lvl 20. i have no intrest in raiding now, thats for the future, and when i get to those lvls ill take the time to learn the skills i need THEN, just like i take the time to find out my next set of skills and how to use them NOW.

    low lvl peeps DONT need to know how to raid, they would survive any "good" dungeons anyhow. and if it takes as much exp to go from 50 to 51 and it did to go from 1-50 im sure ill have PLENTY of time to learn raid skills when i have a hope of hell in being able to use them in the first place. the only thing a lvl 20+ warrior need's to know about raiding lady vox, is to type /ooc looking for a rez, will pay.
    RE: questions
    # Mar 16 2002 at 3:10 PM Rating: Decent
    it looks like to me that verant is just tring to promote rading at low lvls (why cause is fun) on that paert introducing raids at lower lvl means that for the causeal player you don have t0 devote you full time to lvlin so you can reach lvl 50 plus and then get into raids now is going to be more of a all lvl thing. i personally think it would be cool to get a hole bunch of lvl 12 to 20 and go raid one of this dongeuns i think it would be fun and would not make peep think that lvl 1 to 50 is a race o lvl as fast as you can
    K ill rant abit too....
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:59 PM Rating: Default
    I dont read or post for any game ive played but this seems to be a time for a view that i not seen heard yet... I didnt even know about these changes til I happen to stroll into OT last night and heard the 80 plus in there making fun of each ohter likes and dislikes of these changes... and after they went live id wouldnt not have knew the a thing about them til something like the spell book happen to no longer come up... anyway the point Verant cant make everyone happy and if you just joined the EQ game after the changes where made then you would still find something that you didnt like or love it and never stop playing either way what does it really matter these changes are some things ive heard people say that "everyone agreed on the game needed" and now people dont want them... its a game ill play it with the changes or with out them as will most if not all of the people who say they dont like the changes and thats a fact... another fact is Verant isnt going to change them back they way they where anyfaster then it took them to much the changes... so play and have fun or hate the game and quit... as ive done 3 times now it doesnt matter the game will go on and still change and make you happy or mad and back again and vise-versa
    K ill rant abit too....
    # Mar 16 2002 at 1:26 PM Rating: Default
    I dont read or post for any game ive played but this seems to be a time for a view that i not seen heard yet... I didnt even know about these changes til I happen to stroll into OT last night and heard the 80 plus in there making fun of each ohter likes and dislikes of these changes... and after they went live id wouldnt not have knew the a thing about them til something like the spell book happen to no longer come up... anyway the point Verant cant make everyone happy and if you just joined the EQ game after the changes where made then you would still find something that you didnt like or love it and never stop playing either way what does it really matter these changes are some things ive heard people say that "everyone agreed on the game needed" and now people dont want them... its a game ill play it with the changes or with out them as will most if not all of the people who say they dont like the changes and thats a fact... another fact is Verant isnt going to change them back they way they where anyfaster then it took them to much the changes... so play and have fun or hate the game and quit... as ive done 3 times now it doesnt matter the game will go on and still change and make you happy or mad and back again and vise-versa
    K so to the back of MY personal feelings on the changes... (1) sit/med and see ... no brainer here tell me who reading this cant see any other part of the room around them... right so Y cant my char see the same way as they "read" there spellbook?... (2)under 10 die and keep stuff... does it matter if ur new it makes you happy... if your old and twinked/untwinked what does it matter you will just keep playing til your past those junk lvls in one day anyway that doesnt make it faster just makes it less of pain... and (3) come on hell lvls gone... look at it this way Verant said they couldnt fix the math problem and now they do but only before 50... and we dont get the exp we got screwed out of back... what they had to do then IN MY thoughts as a puter tech/programer your the exp valve for the mobs that give exp to people before the Hell lvls and raise the amount the mobs give for the people in the Hell lvls... think about it problem solved... And yes it can be done with out much of problem go to the web and you will see how easy it is to do it... if they didnt do it that way then opps on my part thats the way I would have fixed it beats recoding. Well I like removal how ever it came It shouldnt have been there ever and the bottom line so fix it cuz its broke end off story ur unlucky to have to have been throught it as I have been 5 times myself be happy it gone... well that the end of my rant... til all the flames come at me...
    exp distribution
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:20 PM Rating: Decent
    Im just kinda wondering how the getting rid of hell levels will affect a high level person.

    Will they gain exp from the patch? I think this is a great idea and all, but i sure hope i dont jump from 55-59 or something crazy.

    Conquering
    55 war
    RE: exp distribution
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:31 PM Rating: Decent
    **
    263 posts
    I have not done the math, so dont flame too hard; however, I recall reading (here I think) that it takes more raw exp to go from 50-51 than it does to go from 1-50. I dont think you will be have to worry about jumping from 55-59.
    As I see it
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:12 PM Rating: Decent
    Is it just me, or will this create a lot more high level players and competition for high level raid and group type zones? It's already heavily disputed as is. Now, the low-level changes would probably help me, since I lost my 54 wizard(and account) around the time luclin came out and had to restart with nothing, but, this could just lead to a lot of people who are level 51 and don't know how to play their class well. I've seen it happen before: the twink chanter who can't mez, the cleric who never heals, the druid who doesn't dot or nuke, they just buff every 30 minutes, the monk who can't pull, etc.
    If they were going to do this, they should have done it 2 and a half years ago, when they didn't have to, as opposed to now, when they have a lot of competition and are hoping to keep people playing.
    Bards?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:00 PM Rating: Decent
    Yeah, What about the bards out there? Are we getting screwed once again? I think some bard only weapons for the mid lvls would be outstanding...
    RE: Bards?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 4:19 PM Rating: Decent
    *
    117 posts
    Bards can kick most people in duels if they can play right.
    RE: Bards?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 11:38 PM Rating: Decent
    *
    88 posts
    Too bad you can't earn exp or loot from dueling. :P
    ____________________________
    EverQuest:

    Lifegiver <Iratus Lepus>
    85 Druid, Xegony
    Bonecrushxx <Regnat Populus>
    85 SK, Xegony

    (various other alts)
    Cleric Spell Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 11:47 AM Rating: Decent
    <SIGH> I can't believe after all the hard work with my cleric. Finally I get to rezz !! People send me tells from ALL over Norrath and the Luclin... "Please Good Cleric!!! Paying XXX Plat for a level 49 rez" BAH Now Cleric cherubs can rezz for exp. This just isn't right. I mean I've been playing EQ from week two. I worked hard to get where I am guess it's time to hang up my Mace. Look out Norrath.
    RE: Cleric Spell Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 3:24 PM Rating: Good
    46 posts
    Don't be silly.. all they are doing is giving Revive to lower level. Revive does NOT give exp back..
    RE: Cleric Spell Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:16 PM Rating: Decent
    I can't agree with you more >:\
    RE: Cleric Spell Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:10 PM Rating: Default
    i dotn think is that bad cause if you notice the rezz that lowerlvl clerics get will be rewarding lex xp than yours now on the other hand you guys for slam with the palis rezz (
    #REDACTED, Posted: Mar 16 2002 at 9:18 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Well none of the caster changes mention mages at all, they must be considered melee classes now...Woot!!! They finally get to wear plate armor and duel weild!!! NOT....Verant just screwed em again (
    RE: Mages Melee now?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 1:04 PM Rating: Default
    Hmmm Id take it to mean that there was nothing wrong with your spell lines.

    /em sighs in dissapointment at Ikiv stupidity.
    Our Turn
    # Mar 16 2002 at 6:21 AM Rating: Default
    ***
    1,262 posts
    Melees got buffed, casters got buffed (except for shaman). So when is it time for auxilliary classes to get buffed (rogues,bards,beastlords) and of course, our forgotten shaman?

    Congrats to you folks who got these 'gifts'! I play several classes so I am not making sour grapes here. Just wondering when.....
    RE: Our Turn
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:56 PM Rating: Decent
    28 posts
    Rogues already got ALOT from there original release. We can now evade, hide while sneaking, have minimum backstab damage raised, make poison, apply poison. All things that when rogues were first released we could not do. I love my rogue, with the new gear and AA think we are pretty balanced.

    Achi Lliesheel
    Rogue of Renown
    RE: Our Turn
    # Mar 16 2002 at 11:05 AM Rating: Default
    hehe, dual weild on a caster would make me wanna start one up =)
    it's GUUD ting
    # Mar 16 2002 at 5:32 AM Rating: Decent
    I think a lot of you folks complaining about it being easier are missing the point. Hell levels, I've been through em all four times now. I don't want to start another character, because I dont want to deal with them again. I DO want another character though, but not to go through hell levels, I want him for the high levels I'm enjoying now. The point is, once upon a time, the main goal of this game was to get to 50, when you obtained that goal, farming guk was all that was left... then planes were finally added... then kunark.. velious... luclin... there is a lot more to this game then leveling now, it's still the core, yes, but it's not everything. Any of you that are against the hell level changes made it to 60 yet? 1-50 is what 1-20 was pre kunark. It's a hurdle that is mostly time spent to be able to get at the real game. Soon as they make 59 as easy as 51, I'll see a justification for it being too easy :P Sides, getting people in dungeons exping faster is going to teach folks necessary skills far more then someplace like loio that some folks never leave :P
    RE: it's GUUD ting
    # Mar 16 2002 at 9:20 AM Rating: Decent
    Couple of things:

    First, I think that the strange support for hell levels stems from people's experience with a certain other game and how it could, in fact, be too easy. VI got real lucky with the balance on EQ. However, as this wise poster points out, few of us are newcomers these days and VI needs to serve the community that wants to try a rouge or a ranger but doesn't want to go back to camping the goblins in highkeep for a week before going back to their favorite pasttime of killing vampires.

    I'm also glad that VI is increasing the incentive to learn group skills by adding to the dungeon bonus! I learned to properly tank with my main character only a few weeks ago because I never really had to learn before. This is all good.

    Baboo Dansemacabre
    Shadow Knight of the 44th Season (Hmmm wonder why he is glad hell levels are going away?)

    Edited, Sat Mar 16 09:19:16 2002
    new patch changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 5:27 AM Rating: Default
    Regarding the new patch changes; I think these are wonderful. Interestingly enough no one has mentioned the phenomena claustrophobia in all the messages posted. The fact that this is just a game is irrelevant to those who have this affliction and dungeons are absolutely terrifying to me (I know I'm missing out on some great loot). However, now that I'm level 52 I've been grouping in Karnor's Castle and I don't seem to be experiencing this claustrophobia so much and am quite enjoying it. Go figure.
    RE: new patch changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 5:20 PM Rating: Default
    Wow! And I thought I had problems.
    RE: new patch changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 3:52 PM Rating: Decent
    is your room too small? You are claustrophic about what you see on the screen?

    Get help. Soon.

    RE:in response to hell lvl responses
    # Mar 16 2002 at 5:07 AM Rating: Default
    i think what the deal is about people complaining is that any one new to the game gets it much easyer then someone thats been playing for 3 years and it kinda sucks for them thay thay had to put so much hard earnd work into the game when all people have to do now is go get a group and be lvl 60 with in weeks
    in response to hell lvl responses
    # Mar 16 2002 at 4:06 AM Rating: Default
    It may just be me... but does anyone notice a massive shift in player thinking... a while ago people were complaining constantly about hell lvls and how they should be removed from the game, then when verent said they wouldnt you all flamed them for days on end, now when they finally found a way to give you what you want you are suddenly all for hell levels being there... just because your grandfather had to walk several miles to get to his work doesnt mean that he should be forceing you to not use a car... in other words just because you got through the hell lvls then kudos to you... there is no reason to punish the lower lvls and force them in... and if hell lvls are such a learning experance, that isnt going to change, verant told castersrealm they arent changing the exp requirment table (which would change lvls for people post hell lvl) instead it is likely they will be "smoothing" the curve this doesnt detract from the learning experance but instead leaves it there and just gives the self satisfaction of visible progress... in all i belive these are good changes and in my opinion a sign that verent feels that it now has to listen to its customers to stay compitive...

    ~The Penguin Emperor
    RE: in response to hell lvl responses
    # Mar 16 2002 at 7:49 PM Rating: Default
    You definately have a good point about how people change their minds so quickly...the problem is, alot of people want their time(or exp) back. I myself have been playing since the release and I have played every class to 51 (druid and monk to 56-59). I am all for the removal of pre-51 hells, but I want my experience back. I dont want somebody who has played the exact same way since the good old days in blackburrow, and hasn't learned a thing about patience and how much of a pain this game really can be, running around at lvl 30,35,and 40 without ever being challenged. 45 was probably the toughest level I had to do with any class, 51 was long, but went smoothly. I think if they are going to remove the hells, they should just put a small (10% or so) exp boost for anyone in those levels.
    51?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 3:57 AM Rating: Default
    they talked about 30, 35, 40, 45...but is 51 going to be a hell level still too?
    RE: 51?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 10:52 AM Rating: Decent
    yes, not to mention 52-55, 56-58, and 60 (.1 increase in multiplyer)... 54 and 59 (.2 increase in multiplyer that you need to make up for all previous levels) are double hell still. Really 1-50 was never that bad and I never cared much about it... 51+ is the real ***** of leveling. shrug... not to mention based on the way they phrased the information on the hell levels im willing to bet they require the same ammount of exp to get 1-50 as they used to... its just spread out across the 30+ levels so there is no steep jump in the experience requirements for a given level... honestly i'd like to see them do that with the 50+ levels for 54 and 59 also.
    what about the positive things?
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:34 AM Rating: Default
    new chat channels new (you wont miss a tell wile zone promo !!) not a lot of peolehave the time to be stuck in a hell lvl for 2 o 3 weeks know why cause they have a life i my slef was one a eq freak playing al day and so on so on so on but now days i have a famili and a job and if i want to play a game that will not become more of the same then i will look else were (and is you notice those games are here already ) so what does verant do? they ake the game more aprochable to the causal player for you eq veterants out there there wil be stuff to set yopu asibe form those lvl 60 players that zoomed tru the lvl ( as per your coments) there will be items that need long times to camp epics and you aa stuff i think it was about tie verant made this game more of a casual thing why? cause if they did do it like that then other game were sure goig to kill eq (well at least not let it be the #1 out there or the one with the most income.
    Experience Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:06 AM Rating: Decent
    I cannot say I agree with the core changes here at all. I started playing this game just as kunark was coming out. I know I never experienced the old world while it was still intact, but to me oldworld made more sense. Sort of guided people towards what the rest of the game was going to be like in later levels.

    With the creation of kunark came the three zones that are noted most in a characters lifespan these days are Lake of Ill Omen, Overthere and Dreadlands. If you travel around with group, you will find that nowhere else compares to these zones in terms of exp gain taking risk and difficulty into account. You can and will level from 16 to 45 in these zones.

    Sadly I believe this has spawned alot of lost 50+ characters who have not thought to the boundaries of their class. Something that becomes apparent when you start getting together with people for raids and some people just can't communicate and get along with other people. People do depend on you in these situations. You can't just switch to another group when the going gets tough. Mobs are not overpowered. Yes they are more powerful than you, but the core element of the game focuses on forces of people banding together to overcome a greater foe. The best way to understand what you can do best as a class is to travel around and fight in different places. Take a risk here and there and you might learn something that will save your hide later on.

    So what has been the point of my post. Well...

    "Experience gained in dungeons designed for players level 30 and under will be increased"
    - blergh, you already recieve a significant exp bonus in alot of dungeons as well as vital "bad pathing" experience and how you can deal with it. If increasing the exp bonus is such a good idea, then people should already be fighting more in dungeons than anywhere else in the game.

    "After applying advanced mathematcs, the commonly known "hell-level" xperience gain effect in levels 30, 35, 40, and 45 has been largely done away with"
    - To this I have to say "What!?!". I can't say I really noticed level 30 and 35 being too bad. Yes they seemed slower, but I worked at other areas such as soloing and tradeskills when I couldn't be bothered leveling. Pressure to level and get out of hell levels makes you die in ways that make other players laugh and I myself when I think back. In the end you get out of the level and enjoy the levels after it alot more. I really don't think revamping these levels will solve anything other than to make all levels a blur.

    Some of the changes that have been recently made I applaud. Visible rez timer when you con a Corpse. Brilliant! Cazic Thule being recycled into a high level zone. Fantastic! It was a fun zone to start with, was almost empty after kunark, now a large number of the high levels will return there.

    These latest changes with exp and making it even easier to level your character to 50 won't help to correct any of the truly important issues. To put it bluntly, it's mearly creating more revenue.

    Autlan
    RE: Experience Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:47 AM Rating: Default
    There are some very good points here. Hell lvls are indeed a good learning experience. They also tend to have the effect of making people explore areas instead of staying in Kunark for over 30 lvls. When you get to 50 and group with someone, even people in your own guild, and then go on a raid, you'll see what I mean. They park it next to walls (and have mobs jump them through the wall), they don't check corners when proceeding deeper into the zone, they tend to race ahead of the MA and get slammed like you wouldn't believe... Spending 30+ lvls in Kunark does not teach you how to raid. Exploring, dying, and learning from the experience does.

    Now, I'm not saying that removing the hell lvls is a bad thing, I'm just saying that it may make things worse as far as preparing for raids goes. Hopefully the added exp bonus from dungeon crawling will make up for that.
    #REDACTED, Posted: Mar 16 2002 at 2:19 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) you two are stupid or what?
    #REDACTED, Posted: Mar 16 2002 at 2:50 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) It's posts like this that make me wish I could vote more than once and get them removed via the default filter...
    RE: Experience Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:34 AM Rating: Decent
    What I am saying to joo exlax err ... ectaxyx is that the hell levels are LEARNING levels ... they make better players cuz they promote GROUPING ! I understand that the exp will now be spread out amongst the levels ...BUT without hells ...remember twas more enjoyable to get thru a hell level being in a group cuz they took so long joo had peeps to chat with ....joo killed more mobs quicker and had no downtime so unless ur being PL'ed grouping is by far the fastest way thru hell than soloing ..... JOO NoOb !
    RE: Experience Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:10 AM Rating: Decent
    I agree I remeber when My toons were younger and leveling up ... I dreaded the hell levels but looked forward to getting thru them and thinking ...wow I have done it ....it twas like puttn'anutha notch in ur staff for another dead mob ! It was an accomplishment, an achievement that twas ecstatic ! What wizard cannot remember getting thru level 45 and not looking forward to Ice Comet being just around the corner ? NONE I tell yas ! ....Anyways IMHO there will be too many Higher levels not understanding how to play thier toons and making the game that much more frustrating to have to put up with them ! Peeps that use LoIO/OT/DL I applaud because the majority of peeps in those zones are GROUPING ...learning what thier roles in a group are and how to use thier skills to the groups advantage !




    Chemkyl Starfyre 54 Channeler xev server
    "know when to burn and when not to burn ; only then will yee truly understand the power yee yield !"
    Chemee Bladesnatcher 51 Rogue Xev server
    "GET IN FRONT OF THE MOB STUPID RANGER! "

    Edited, Sat Mar 16 02:15:29 2002
    RE: Experience Changes
    # Mar 16 2002 at 8:27 AM Rating: Decent
    bieng fairly new to eq as compared to many( istarted last july) i feal that gettign rid of hell lvs are a good thing.
    I have not yet got a charaacter over 50( ihave chareaters in 30's and 40's) because of hell lvs. i cant stand endless amouts of time doing the pull-kill-repeat.
    As for the opinion about them being learning lvs, if you have no idea how to play your char by 30 there isnt a heck of a lot of hope for figureing it out by sitting in LOIO, OT, and DL, which is what i see most people doing. i hate these zones haveing spent some time in them i do not plan on ever sitting in them again. i feal that there are better places to enjoy the game.
    If the extra xp gets people into a dungeons pre 50 that is a good thing seeing as most of them are empty most of the time.
    Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 1:41 AM Rating: Decent
    I don't know how to take this news. I am a 53 cleric that worked my butt of for this level and I feel proud of this. A cleric being able to rez at low levels, kinda distrubing. I worked to being to rez people, if I see a lvl 34 cleric casting Ressurection, I will scream.

    The idea about getting rid of meditation. It was an accomplishment, to finally be able to see and now they get it early. Unfair to the later players.

    As for the exp changes, I might be the only one to say I didn't hate the hell levels. They we like platforms, I would level like crazy, hit lvl 35 and go explore, do some quests and have fun, then lvl grind to 40 and do it again. It was during these hell levels, that my Kuluku *my cleric* got her identity. What kind of identity are you gonna have grinding for 60 levels straight.

    Just my opinion
    RE: Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:52 PM Rating: Decent
    Of course your not gonna agree with my comments, your not a cleric, so your comments have no meaning. All you want are lower rezs so you can get them. You care nothing for the gameplay, what your gonna have now are clerics who are lower level shout "rezzing for donations", and you complain I do this. not, sure I will rez if I'm offered 200pp, but generally I rez on the fly for free, ask anyone from my server.

    As for the hell levels, I never said it would take more exp, and you complain I should read first, open your eyes and read what I wrote. I wrote I like the hell levels, as they were a plateau for me. I would get bored and do otherthings like skill levels and stuff.

    I read the changes, maybe it is your that should read what I wrote before opening YOUR mouth
    RE: Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:44 PM Rating: Default
    **
    263 posts
    You sound like one of those clerics that worked their collective butt off just so you could shout "rezzing for donation" or something similar. The mini-rezzes are there to help the game. A group will now be able to do more and learn more by being able to get moving again faster. Much easier to have a cleric bind nearby, rez the wipeout and start fighting again. As opposed to waiting 20+ min for the tanks to run 3-5 zones (or more).

    Sorry if you dont benefit directly, but the gaming community as a whole will.
    RE: Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 11:00 AM Rating: Default
    Excuse me Mr. Cleric sir, but of course you don't like the new changes designed for low lvl characters, since you've already reached a higher lvl you get no benefit from them. For one thing, it is not going to be any easier to get to lvl 60 now then it ever was. 5 different lvls of exp got dramatically increased while about 32 of them got increased moderately. I.E. all the hell lvls went down, but every level in between them went up. It'll take the same amount of time to reach 50/60 there just won't be a defining lvl of boredom people will get bored with grinding at different lvls will just depend on the person. Secondly grow up, I mean there've been non stop advancements to the high end game, and this is the first time in a long time they've advanced the low end game. No one likes a whiner.

    :-P
    RE: Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:04 AM Rating: Default
    hum you need to read the changes and understand them before you open your mouth =p

    im glad that lower lvl clerics are getting rezz know why cause you going to have more 30 below raids more of that hi end game we all love at lower lvls they are rnot removing xp to make it were it will be faster to lvl to 60 =p think about it that would be unfair let me explain what they going to do so peeps like you dont open their mouth talking trash

    lets take for exaple hell lvl 35 lets say this lvl requiers you to get 5000 xp point (this is and example it will take way more than that)
    hel lvls req twice much xp then normal lvl so lets say that from 32 to 33 and from 33 to 34 you need 2500 xp to lvl well instead of making this huge lvl (35) they are going to make all lvls requiere approximately the rigth amount of xp so instead of totaly doing away wit the extra xp needed to lvl at 35 they going to bistribute it alon the lvls say make lvl 32 to 33 3250 xp point to lvl like this you will still need the same amount of xp to get to lvl 60

    if you didnt understand what i just explain to you o well but if you dont know what you talking about then shut your face.

    ps the med thin o well at least i know that some point in the game from my past characters i earnd that rigth to med with out book so suck it up

    RE: Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 5:29 PM Rating: Decent
    To ectaxyx and others:

    I think the person you replied to understands the changes just fine and was *not particularly upset by them.

    I agree with them on almost all points: I've never for a minute even believed that Hell lvls were a mistake - it's too coincidentally VERY sound psychology ;-p lol ... ever heard of a variable reinforcment schedule? It's easy to feel manipulated when one thinks of it that way but the fact remains that having a rolling flow of challenges fosters interest and periodically gives a special sense of accomplishment. If I'd designed the game, I'd have put them in on purpose (tho loathed myself for the manipulation) and i just can't really believe that Verant didn't do just that.

    And as far as the rezzes go - well, it definitely a game-changer and it'll be a bit frustrating to get used to as people sort out the new economy (of needs, not pp). I'll say that it *does* seem really annoying that they'd put in new rez spells every 5 lvls - for god's sake, that's too many spells to buy and some people will undoubtedly be greedy about scraping every last bit of returned exp from the higher lvl clerics in the zone, even if they have rezzer in their group - that'll be sad to see. I'd much rather see those spells every *other* spell circle, but /shrug they didn't ask me...

    I just hope that all of these myriad changes don't mean that Verant will get in the habit of making this a diff game - changing this much is hard to keep track of if nothing else. It seems to me that perhaps they should have made a new style of game for the more casual players called Legends and left it very separate from EQ - EQ is a game that has a life of its own and honestly i think it deserves to be fostered as is by VI. They still owe EQ some backpay, if you will, in unfinished promises and all of this schtuff with legends and these changes seem to just be sparkly distraction from that.
    RE: Not sure
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:17 AM Rating: Default
    Just a honest question. What makes you the expert and how come you're so dang mean about it? Man no one likes a smart a$$. No one went off the handle like you did in any of the posts. People just posting their opinions and concerns and you flame them. Flame this post all you want it just makes you look smaller
    #REDACTED, Posted: Mar 16 2002 at 2:26 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) hum what makes me and expert is playing the game since close beta and all the 3 years that i been in eq why am i a smart *** hum i dont know maybe cause littel cry babys like you get their feelings hurt p if you dont know what you talking about dont talk if you want to expres your fealling about something read the facts before you speak. misleading info is only going to do one thing make new people to the game think the wrong thing not only that but eventually will give birth to the most hated kind of player that there could be the one that take a damm cleric to melle wile the tank dies in a raid (trust me i seen them out there) so please take your littel cry baby talk and go somewere else
    When
    # Mar 16 2002 at 1:33 AM Rating: Decent
    Does anyone know when this takes affect
    RE: When
    # Mar 16 2002 at 2:05 AM Rating: Default
    rumors are monday i think is going to be monday cause the patch looks like is going to take longer than any patch =p
    Shamans
    # Mar 16 2002 at 12:03 AM Rating: Default
    Where is anything for the shaman. Most of the shaman items seem to miss the most important part, the WIS. They talk about every other caster. The shaman deserves to be treated well.
    Not sure
    # Mar 15 2002 at 11:05 PM Rating: Decent
    No need to stare at spell book, that is how a good caster learns their craft as tehy have no distractions.
    I totally agree with removing some of the aggro with a new cahracter, but you have to learn how to use the character
    revives at low level, thanks verant, i have worked my butt off to get to my first revive & now you say what the hell, lets give it to twink newbies.
    want to improve the game, stop twinking, & put more emphasis on exploring and questing than mindless killing to level, i can play Doom and do that
    some good stuff, some very bad stuff, is this knee jerk reaction due to the new games due out this year?
    Bahhhh
    # Mar 15 2002 at 10:50 PM Rating: Good
    I kinda hate the fact that there will be more high lvl toons that have no idea how to play there class because they lvled to damn fast.

    Jeez peeps can ya emagine a cleric acting like a druid does at lvl 45 when he realises after all that time he finally has to learn how to interact with a group ?

    And as far as hell lvl's, and looking at the book, heck it gives ya somthing to look forward to, instead of the same old thing you have had since lvl one.
    My opinions
    # Mar 15 2002 at 10:38 PM Rating: Decent
    1) Hell levels going away... Well, I'm going to bench my level 40 Cleric until after the patch :D. I'm also going to push my level 43 Paladin up to 44 before the patch if I can. Just seems like a wise idea. Other than that, I think it's a good thing.

    2) No "Book Medding" before 35... Eh, I'm indifferent to this change. I guess it's part of making people more willing to go into dungeons at lower levels.

    3) Keeping items upon death up until level 10. Blah... this will increase low-level twinkage even more. Besides, there's nothing like dying to make you learn the zone that much faster (and know who can help you... like Bards, Necros & SKs.)

    4) Increasing xp from 1-10. Blah... Too many twinker-bells complaining that the low levels are boring, that's all that is. My Vah Shir Shamaness is already level 13, and there's many quests for her that I haven't completed that involves mobs that are totally green to her now.

    5) Res spells, dungeon xp increase & new evacs... all very excellent. Anything that gets people into dungeons is a good thing.

    6) Halfling Rangers = Good. Gnome ShadowKnights = Not bad. Gnome Paladins = Not good. Halfling Paladins = Bad.

    7) Spell changes... all good so far.

    8) Focus Items... I'm holding judgement until I see some info on them.
    RE: My opinions
    # Mar 15 2002 at 11:38 PM Rating: Good
    I pretty much agree. In my experience with pencil-and-paper RPG's and design of such, I've found the level system to be patently ridiculous (track me down on another board if you want to dispute this), and when I heard how VI did their level calculations for EQ, I laughed. Hard. They have (and had) high-end servers that could munch a simple quadratic (eg, ((LVL)*(LVL)+ 2*(LVL)+1)*100, or something) without breaking a sweat. They're finally, it seems, doing this, so kudos on that.

    My opinion on the book depends. I think the book should just be transparent, but don't have a problem with it opaque. It makes sense, since you don't get XP from reading in magical libraries. ;)

    Keeping items on death to level 10 I like. It's a pain-in-the-*** hassle to go find my damn body every time I die on those lower levels, one that made me take a year off the game. I mean come on, if those levels are supposedly so easy and can be done in a day as some people claim, then it's such a patent non-issue as to make it a moot point. Maybe some of us who are new or non-junkies will be able to see past level 14 now.
    The increase in XP, though, I disagree with--unless there's no incentive to go dungeon crawling as is. Sorry, I grew up on D&D, I always wonder why the bartender isn't offering to send me into some crypt. ;p

    Chat channels are cool, zoning improvements--WOOHOO!!--and colour tinting... is just.. oh-so-cool. :)
    OMG
    # Mar 15 2002 at 10:27 PM Rating: Decent
    Gnome shadow knights ::shudder:: they have "gno" idea of the evil they are about to unleash upon Norrath.
    Looks like the forces of good have a new terror look out for.
    RE: OMG
    # Mar 16 2002 at 9:36 AM Rating: Decent
    Gnomes being the superior race makes this a dangerous addition. When a gnome SK enters a zone most mobs will just drop dead from fear.
    these changes suck
    # Mar 15 2002 at 10:21 PM Rating: Decent
    i dont think they should be changing the game this greatly... hell levels are the only levels i actually can remember...
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