I think if you factor in good luck then a rogue can tie a ranger for the award for "highest melee output" I have seen rogues sneak up to an ongoing battle of some large mob and backstab for some rediculous amount, take the loot and sneak away. Not very admirable but then again is there really any honor amung thieves?
#REDACTED,
Posted:Jun 04 2003 at 12:31 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) any group that can get outdamaged by a single rogue deserves to have its loot taken away. and if they didnt figure out that its against EQ rules for the rogue to do it and petition then they are just complete morons....
To the poster lower down who said best melee damage is Rogue/monk/warrior/ranger is way off. Best dmg dealer is Ranger with AM3+EQ, useing a decent bow. After that would be Rogue then Monk then last but not least Warrior. I hate too burst your bubble but Rangers are no longer paper tanks allways LFG.Admittedly bows are situational but in the right setting our damage is sick, fire off Trueshot disc and then it just gets silly, it really is that good.
I as a Warrior hate to admit it, but you are correct. No matter what anyone says, a Ranja is by far the highest output melee in game. I was with my guild in UP when our lvl 65 Ranja popped off trueshot and KS'ed a full group. I don't give a dam what anyone says, nobody can beat a Ranja's melee output. And with a fatal bowshot, rediculous. Hands down and hats off to Ranja's.
last i checked bows were nonmelee so rangers are the best at bow damage true but that doesnt mean best melee output or did the ranger posting this forget it says soandso is hit for 15 points nonmelee damage
im not arguing against it just the face that bows arent melee as with any ranged item now if a duel centi ranger can outdo my rogue then ill agree with the rangers are the best melee until then esp since my rogue averages 250-300 per bs and has a max of 435
Got these a few days ago for my Barbarian Warrior on Quellious. Indeed they appeared like silver plate with blue kilt UNTIL I turned all the armours on in my eqclient file...now they look utterly different: like gold spandex with a neat design. So here I am with my Warrior modeled in the image of Conan, plate all over BUT for his spandex gold leggings - no kilt - just very tight butt-hugging spandex. I was not too happy. Many people would probably really like the look; it just doesn't fit my style. However, because of the incredible ac, I will suck it up and deal with it until I can complete some higher armour quests or make myself some Helanic Tundra.
#REDACTED,
Posted:Jan 17 2002 at 12:35 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) An SK can out taunt a warrior anyday, but in most cases warriors have more ac/hp (mind you most cases not all). Oh and btw the SK epic dps is horrible and IMHO id rather have a massive dragonclaw shard 28/30 1hs or better and the xtra ac/stats of a shield i.e. atramentous or fearsome, etc. So the SK epic is not always necessary.
A wise person once said "any fool can out-taunt a warrior, but only a fool would try."
Sure, we SK can tank, most stuff anyway. But if I'm grouped with a warrior I always let them have aggro, it's just common sense. They have more hp and better AC (if they are anywhere near as good at their class as I am at mine.) And more hp/AC mean fewer CH from cleric, which means longer life for the group.
The only time i ever taunt off the main tank in a group is when our healer falls asleep and the tank gets below 15% health. even then though, it's just "taunt, engulfing darkness, spear of disease, taunt" and the mob is on me, no matter how long the tank has had aggro. and in extreme cases, there's HT.
sure, we can outtaunt them. we even have spells SPECIFIC for the purpose of getting aggro. but why else would we want to?
Inn Curse DPS is horrible? Sorry, but that is just plain silly.
You are among the many that frequently underestimate the effectiveness of the Soul Consumption proc. 250 points over 30 secs (DPS of 8.33) is AWESOME. Not to mention the healing aspect of it.
Run the numbers. On the proc, Inn curse outdamages quite a few weapons, including weapons that you otherwise would think it wouldnt
SK Epic DPS is not horrible at all. The proc rate on the sword in quite amazing and basically the SK is constantly regening because of it at a fast pace. That proc DOT lifetap also has to be added into the equation when considering damage of the weapon. Now whether a person should use a shield is a matter of debate. Sure if you are main tank in a raid a shield and a 1 hander is the way to go but most of the time in raids the SK is not the main tank and is better served haveing the constant regen from the proc to help reduce the impact of AoE. Also in solo this sword rocks, almost every SK I know with the epic uses the IC solo unless they have Palladius's axe.
#REDACTED,
Posted:Jan 29 2002 at 5:54 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) dunno why this post is here considering it should be about the legs but i'll add some random babble anyway :P
#REDACTED,
Posted:Mar 10 2002 at 11:30 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Nice to be a DE sk too, switching to the now DE usable Greenmist :p
bought hero's khukri, greenish metal shard, and history of the greenmist in bazaar for a pleasantly nice price. my erudite SK will have greenmist soon after i get a few thousand more bonechips...
Its pretty easy to get faction for cabilis, in every part of it (full ally with cabilis) if you dont think TIME makes something hard. it will be damn easy for a level 30+ sk to MOW DOWN exiled iksars, just probably very time consuming. can be done though. luckily for me, I dont think "time consuming = hard". easy.
Unfortunately, the Hero's Khukri is droppable. So all you have to do is find an Iksar SK willing to sell you his Khukri and then do the quest to get the first Khukri back. As far as faction, there's always the bonechip quest which, while painfully tedious, will give the necessary faction to turn in the Hero's Khukri for the Lord of Pain's Khukri (which is the last Khukri quest before Greenmist).
Seen people trying to buy them on Nameless a few times recently. >:(
Just like any other drop off any other named. My group has personally gotten four of these of these and I'm postive that there is more than one other person on the server that has them
I currently have a pair of these for sell on the tribunal. asking for 50k send tells to chulito or saddann will accept trades but has to be one or two "uber" items not 500,000 yaks. can negotiate but got with a partner so whatever happens goes through us both
In the average xp group, a SK actually makes a better tank than a warrior, especially if they have the epic.
The SK taunt factor totally owns with rogues/rangers/monks in the group, casters can nuke away and never get aggro.
With circlet of shadows, snare, and fd SKs can in some cases outpull monks by snaring, invising, and running the mob through a sea of greenies. Snared mobs are also much easier to feign split in general.
Self only damage shield, lifetaps, snare are very nice for your tank to have. Harm Touch isn't a great source of damage, but it stops gaters at the push of a button.
With c2 and epic an sk can tank a slowed mob and rarely need a heal. In my experience SKs are better equipped on average due to less competition. It was common for me to have a higher AC than warriors I'd group with.
It boils down to: If you don't HAVE to have defensive, you don't NEED a warrior.
As a (52) sk myself, I totally agree with you. Having a 52 monk as a friend, when it comes to group splitting I always get the job because its so easy with our darkness line...the only problem is the long reuse of FD (fixed with LoY spell Comatose, takes 7 seconds less to reuse....still only 54sec max on duration though).
#REDACTED,
Posted:Aug 31 2001 at 2:15 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) pallies taunt better than warriors and SKs w/ the stuns. pallies can have almost the same AC as a warrior (war can get more cuz of better armour available, though not ez to obtain), if the warrior is not uberly twinked, ie w/ full tov armour. i am the main tank in 99% of the groups i've been in.
#REDACTED,
Posted:Sep 08 2001 at 8:55 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) the point you are missing, i believe, is that shadowknights are primarily offensive, and are better at taunting. paladins are defensive tanks, thus they can buff better, heal, and blind/root/stun their opponent. in my opinion, sk's should get dual wield, but they should lose bash, parry, riposte (maybe not riposte), and then they will become a primarily offensive tank.
LOL Sk's are not offensive tanks. Rangers are the offensive. SK's are somewhere in the middle. They are KNIGHTS, just dark knights. Ever read Dragonlance? Or any other fantasy novels? The dark knights follow the same exact code as the good knights, just for evil purposes. Therefore.. there the same, with just a little differences. Paladins get healing spells and stuns, SK's get dots and snares. Their tanking abilities are pretty much the same, there damage output is pretty much the same.. I highly doubt they will ever get duel weild hehe Its just not becoming of a knight ;)
Rayna Harkonen 59 Paladin Leader of Magnus Solusek Ro
For those who whine and complain about how overpowered SKs are, let me give you a reality check...
FACT1: SKs are EVIL. This means that when you hunted Oasis, you could go to the gypsies/inn for food and water, and I had to walk ALL the way back to Neriak or Grobb, dodging Slate and friends through lag-infested EC, many times dying just for that. That in EQ, is what being EVIL means... It gets worse as you increase your level, at least until you can start killing Slate and friends back >:)
FACT2: SKs are low damage tanks with a few minorly useful spells until level 30. Want to know why a lot of SKs solo? They aren't allowed in groups because they can't tank (well) and they can't hit (well), and if they taunt, they won't be saved easily. The only thing they are used by groups pre-30 is fear kiting, and the occaisonal snare.
FACT3: HT is WAY worse than LoH, admittedly this is targeted at paladins, but it must be recognized that HT is only really usefull in the early newbie years, where it helps to save your life, or solo yellas/reds (your choice) Once you go past 30, the damage you deal with it is laughable on the scale of the mob's HP. This improves slightly post-40, but not tremendously.
This then is why SKs have the good weapons/armors. This is the reason we played and slaved through the grueling early years of our class! Our class is one of the "late-bloomers", so it makes perfect sense that we get some hefty rewards from sticking with our class so long. I take twice as long to gain a level as a human paladin, and four times to break hell. I have EARNED the right to wield awesome weapons and armor like this. And for your information, I don't have this, I'm a poor SK who has scraped together some sentient and a BABS and still wears some fine plate. It is items like this that make me keep playing my SK as my main, despite the hardships, trials and tribulations.
Ghurn Dagrotesque Troll Shadowknight of the 44 Skull Shadowstormers, Karana
#REDACTED,
Posted:Mar 03 2002 at 8:18 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) at 55 us SK's get a /dis that increases the damage of a harm touch. Taking it from 700ish to around 1.5k. HT will save your mother *censored* *censored* a lot of times.
Sounds like all your hardship comes from being a TROLL, not from being a Shadowknight. TROLLS have exp penalties, TROLLS are kos to sgt slate (DE are dubious). You have the right complaints for the wrong reasons.
I do agree with you that SKs really shine in the higher levels. A lvl 60 shadowknight is just a joy to have around. Most SK's I see having problems leveling is due to having social problems (ever notice that most ppl who play necros and sk's are pre-teens?) and groups avoiding the PLAYER not the class.
Oh, and the HT/LoH argument is just silliness. Both have uses, and both are damn near never used so it's moot.
Or Iksar ..... we don't have it terribly easy, but that's the way we want it ;-). I agree on the "late blooming" part. Life post-40 has gotten far better, and post-50 will be setter still. As for the LoH/HT taunting arguments -- lots of sides to it in my exp. My HT is saved in case I need to quickly get aggro off a caster. My taunts are scarily good, and I click off my lifetaps if the MA warrior is close in level, and switch to a 2HS so I don't hit too fast. If I have taps/DoTs up, and use Shard of Night (21/24), it is *really* hard to take aggro from me. And actually I hope not to group with people who want to take aggro from me if I'm MA!
#Anonymous,
Posted:May 04 2001 at 9:19 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Well they do. They blow next to cobalt.
#Anonymous,
Posted:Apr 04 2001 at 5:45 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) if your talking about old style pre expansion eq then all warriors do is tank if your talking new style then you will know that at high lvls tanks do huge amounts of damage constantly. Its the weapons upgrade it used to be the case that warriors held em with 2 8 dmg 24 dly yaks and that was taht...well now its different i use either a 10/18 crafted velium warsword and a 9/19 lammy or the sword and a 9/18 jade mace...thats massive dmg considering all my skills have gone up to the 240 mark and my equpipment an lvl mean i hit more often and harder...
#REDACTED,
Posted:Feb 15 2001 at 8:13 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Verant is *FU**ED* UP! Shadowknights are WAY overpowered as it is. Hopefully soon, Paladins and Shadowknights will have Defense = to a Warrior's defense, which means a harsh increase of AC. Shadowknight's can outtaunt anyone, Feign Death, Fear, DoT, etc etc ETC! They get *countless* weapons that are SHD only or WAR SHD or something gay like that. They get superior ratio weapons and armor to Paladins. Verant is totally totally messing up the very thin balance between Shadowknights and Paladins (if one even existed). I'd withdraw this statement if I ever see any WAR PAL or PAL only greaves with >>>36<<< AC (I probably won't though know Verant and they're ***** *** idea of the "Roleplay" Paladin...might as well dress Paladins in god damn Raw-hide).
Lol! Way overpowered? Not yet,but I am only 53.Anyways I am most usefull in small groups or situations where an enchanter is not needed.In raids I am not allowed to taunt even though Shadow nights taunt great(and rightly so war has the disciplines and hps to make healing him more mana efficient).In groups where an enchanter is needed I can't use half my spells as they won't allow mez or won't stack with chanter buffs.So in a raid or enchanter group I am basically a low dmg warrior.This is why SKs get to be as you call it "Way overpowered".I have alot of other abilities that help in a group but they are shared by other classes who do them better.I am not whining I love my SK more than any other character I play and after the new dmg tables I really think the only improvement needed for my class is a few more group friendly spells.Maybe like the shroud line.Steal ac for the group would be cool :)
#REDACTED,
Posted:May 21 2001 at 8:50 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Well maybe you shouldn't have been a sorry @#% paladin...oh yeah don't forget paladins can heal out the waz almost better than druids, have LoH which is 2468214610987489574524 times better than HT, and also get a rez...wow paladins really suck...blah blah blah....
Des legs be real gud gud legs for warriors. Me tink yous takin too much crack frum dem chanters. Warriors needs da high ac, no need stats as much. And yous just luk at what it take off, -5agi -5dex, dat nuttin, dat just 1 plat bp ring, nuttin at all. Me would love to have des. So if anyone on bristlebane have dem and tink dem cursed, yous find me, me Mordreth, yous give dem to me, me be happy den. 36ac -5dex -5agi not curse it a blessing! Everyone know des be warrior armors, even if dem can be used by uddas, luk who da main warrior races be, not elfies, not halflings, not dwarves, dem be trolls, ogres and barbarians. We be da powerhouses, what care us if we lose 5agi and dex, we get nice legs!
And mees tink joos a dam idiot. What makes you think a butt ugly Troll, a dentally impaired Ogre, and a stinkin **** Barbarian make the best Warriors? It is peeps like you that think STR is the only stat that matters, well hate to be the one that informs you of this, but you are wrong. STR is good to have, and I'm glad I have 252 STR, but it is by far not the most important stat for a Warrior. Try a little Stamina for HP, or a little Agility for AC. Those 2 stats are the most important for a Warrior, they are the reason we are chosen for Tanking. With them you get hit for less damage and your health aint falling so fast cause you got more of it, Clerics will love you for these 2. And as far as who is the best warrior, I vote for the DWARF.
Bustauff 55 Dwarven Warrior Officer of Exiled Outcasts Luclin Server
dex is used for crits and crips, not just for proccing weapons. As far as monks vs. rogue damage, a rogue with double backstab will outdamage a monk anyday if the tank can keep the mob's attention, which is his job.
#Anonymous,
Posted:Jan 10 2001 at 11:47 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) uh, you mention that others can use it? Look closely friend; warrior only.
i agree except for the part about trolls/ogres/barbs being main warriors. iksars can hold their own and quite well you should know. sure they arent as strong as the barbs, trolls, or warriors, but who cares? a warriors job is not to do damage, its to take damage. flame all you want, but leave the damage output to the monks and rogues. these legs let you take damage (or absorb damage i guess) and quite well. -5agi and -5dex is nothing compared to 36ac and an extra 25hp. for my iksar, helm of rile offsets the -5agi and i dont use any proc'ing weapons so who cares about dex. these legs own and dont let anyone tell you otherwise!
#Anonymous,
Posted:Mar 16 2001 at 1:43 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) umm for the guy who thinks warriors dont need to do damage.... how else are you gonna tank somethin if you cant agro it enough to hit you??
#REDACTED,
Posted:Jan 28 2002 at 10:57 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) with that cute taunt button.....
monks yes, rougues no...rogues backstab is good WHEN you are behind the creature, and since backstabbing will make the creature aggro you, you are constantly circling around creatures to get behind them. Not as efficient as monks.
FYI I love a good monk, But Rogues are the top melee damage dealers in game, plain and simple. For pure melee the order is as follows... Rogue, Monk, Warrior, Ranger, Pally/SK, Bard. That of course is not taking into consideration the hybrid spells which when used correctly can bring Rangers/SK's about even with a Warrior. All of the classes have a purpose, they are all usefull. Play what you want, dont let others tell you it was a bad choice, and try to remember... Its just a game.
Taiil Chayser 52 Halfling Champion Proud Member of Steel Thunder Seventh Hammer
Seems like quite a few items found on Velious have really good stats... and also really bad stats. For instance, an Ulthork hide tunic, wearable by leather-using classes, has +3wis and +35mana, but also has -5cha and -35hp.
#Anonymous,
Posted:Jan 07 2001 at 9:01 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) are you talking about the iksar pariah mask? if so then its 5ac, -25cha. my iksar warrior loves his mask, wears it all the time. so what if my cha is now 30? i lost so much money selling stuff to vendors from 50cha i hardly notice loosing any more by having a 30. the 5ac and 0.5wt make up for that easily.