Original
The Compendium of Haste
http://cloud.prohosting.com/~talone/HasteData.htm
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Cloak of Flames
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[Drops | Comments ]
DropsThis item is found on creatures. Burning Woods
Emerald Jungle
Nagafen's Lair
Skyfire Mountains
Western Wastes
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#REDACTED,
Posted: Nov 24 2002 at 11:19 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) HOW MUCH IS THE CLOAK WORTH AND HOW MUCH % DOES THE HASTE DO?
9 posts
Its work around 90k in brell server andi am not sure how much has and the guy thats said 2 copper, get a life and get serouse
#REDACTED,
Posted: Dec 01 2002 at 5:14 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) ITS WORTH LIEK 2 COPPER AND I THINK ITS 157% HASTE ON IT
getting back to the topic at hand, what is the haste on the CoF and how does it compare to others (such as the seblisian berserker claok or RBG)? the posts that had that info have apparently been forced off the thread by the large number of ranting and blamecalling posts. After all, its for info that people come here. Not to read everyone and their mother's opinion on loot rules and who should get items, and everything else y'all ahve discussed on this thread besides the actuale CoF.
14 posts
36% That is the most widely excepted number for haste on this and CoCW. Seblisian is in the 20s (I can't remember, and not at my normal computer). RBG is 26 or 32, I also can't remember. I'll edit this for actual values later, hehe. So, the CoF or CoCW is better haste% than either of those other items. Plus getting a better belt than RBG isn't as hard (IMO) or as expensive as getting a cloak better than CoF. :)
Flowing Black Silk Sash - 21%
Silver Chitin Handwraps - 22%
Siblisian Bezerker Cloak - 26%
Runebranded Girdle - 27%
Runed Bolster Belt - 31%
Spiked Seahorse Spine Belt - 24%
Cloak of Flames, Cloak of Crystalline Waters, Cowl of Mortality - 36%
Silver Chitin Handwraps - 22%
Siblisian Bezerker Cloak - 26%
Runebranded Girdle - 27%
Runed Bolster Belt - 31%
Spiked Seahorse Spine Belt - 24%
Cloak of Flames, Cloak of Crystalline Waters, Cowl of Mortality - 36%
10 posts
Why is selling for PP greedy? Platinum is worthless in itself. You don't get interest on it, we are not earning it for our retirement. We want it to spend on upgrades, that's it. If and when a melee finds a better item than CoF, is he going to give it away because he has no NEED anymore? And, of course, guilds create different circumstances. Half this page is regarding useless Guild tangents. Everyone agree? NBG in guild raids? The argument is about open raids, yes?
NBG boy oh boy they really need to make this no drop
The sick amounts of money floating around in game
I mean you can't even walk if you are carrying 100k
In my guild it is always NBG on raids.
I recall a jade reaver in COM that a certain Enchanter from Santus Arcunum
looted
Then turned around and sold it. We had 3 druids there helping and these guys show up
to buff they say and whammo they loot and run with the item we where there for
I regularly group with a enchanter necro and cleric
I give all money and jewels to cleric and items are fairly distributed amongst the group.
We all have some pretty nice gear because of this.
But only like 5k in the bank between us.
I say NBG but i also say that casters need to be fairly compensated for there time
When i bring my group on raids only one member of our party will roll
Weather it's a caster item or melee i am always the designated roller and i hand out the items
It has worked great for me
Bottem line is you fools need to shut the hell up and play the game and you casters need to get the b ug out your **** in regards to looting class defining items to sell
If spells drop the melee's always hand em up
I have never seen a tank roll on a spell or a caster robe or other item
Fair compensation is a must but still NBG should be the rule
The sick amounts of money floating around in game
I mean you can't even walk if you are carrying 100k
In my guild it is always NBG on raids.
I recall a jade reaver in COM that a certain Enchanter from Santus Arcunum
looted
Then turned around and sold it. We had 3 druids there helping and these guys show up
to buff they say and whammo they loot and run with the item we where there for
I regularly group with a enchanter necro and cleric
I give all money and jewels to cleric and items are fairly distributed amongst the group.
We all have some pretty nice gear because of this.
But only like 5k in the bank between us.
I say NBG but i also say that casters need to be fairly compensated for there time
When i bring my group on raids only one member of our party will roll
Weather it's a caster item or melee i am always the designated roller and i hand out the items
It has worked great for me
Bottem line is you fools need to shut the hell up and play the game and you casters need to get the b ug out your **** in regards to looting class defining items to sell
If spells drop the melee's always hand em up
I have never seen a tank roll on a spell or a caster robe or other item
Fair compensation is a must but still NBG should be the rule
LOL , Nice Prayer:)
27 posts
Sorry to sound like a total newbie but- What is an NBG? Is it a thing, or type? I've never been on a real raid, my main is only 29, so cut me some slack, eh? Nice item, btw...
6 posts
Need Before Greed
NBG is great in guild groups and events. It makes sure people are getting upgrades to their current gear. But if I'm out grouping with other than guildies or friends, it's best off just going open lotto on all with winners having to wait until everyone else gets something. Otherwise, what warrior in their right mind is gonna MT for a PoD courtyard group, knowing that the only valuable drops are parchments? They gain a lesser benefit for their time spent than the casters.
Imbued Granite Spaulders, a fungi tunic, an RBG, a CoF, etc are the type of items that can get someone a huge headway into their epic, or perhaps be traded or sold to fund armor multiquests.
NBG in open groups is just greed, imho. For a guild, it's survival.
Imbued Granite Spaulders, a fungi tunic, an RBG, a CoF, etc are the type of items that can get someone a huge headway into their epic, or perhaps be traded or sold to fund armor multiquests.
NBG in open groups is just greed, imho. For a guild, it's survival.
I'm a full supporter of Need Before Greed. Or as I say, Need, NOT Greed. I'm also a supporter of Class only. If only certain classes can use an item and several of those classes are present, it is only RIGHT that those classes get to roll for the item. I also beleive if you have an item that is better then what dropped, you should decline from rolling for it. Why you ask? Because it plain out sucks to think that all you hard work and the risk you have taken are gonna go for nothing. That someone that can't even use the item is just gonna sell it. Any player that says "But I could use the item to sell for plat" is not one I will group with willingly anymore. And one that I would not willingly lay my life down for in the future.
Point of fact, EVERYONE NEEDS MONEY, that's why they call it money (Danny DeVito, The Heist). There is not a single player that doesn't need money. For improving trade skills or upgrading equipment or finally getting a horse.
And since everyone needs money, that means it is the LOWEST common reason why people should get to roll for drops. There fore, Greed, in my book should never be counted as a reason for who gets what loot.
Another growing trend is people looting for a friend. This happens alot on the Firiona Vie, the server I play on. Example: me and some friends were in Great Divide, pulling Shardwurms. We took in a ranger (who was a bad puller on top of everything). Everything is going fine, when the necro spell drops. None of these spells sell for a lot. But there is a quest in Plane of Knowledge that requires all foue spells from the 4 different pure casters that drop there. I asked if I could have the spell and explained why, for a quest. His reply was, well, I have a necro friend that could use this spell. He then said Well, need before greed. I do have a need for it, I need it for a quest. I explained the quest again. He kept saying, yes but my friend can actually use the spell, not just lose it for turning it in. I pointed out to him that I was the one here fighting and have a need for the spell and that over rules his friends need for the spell, who I was NOT here, fighting the shardwurms. My solution was that everyone in the group roll for it, and if he loses the roll, and should another copy of the spell drop he can have it without rolling. He lost the roll, and the person that did win gave me the spell. Next shardwurm the same spell dropped. Figures.
I am not fighting mobs to give the loot to someone elses friend who is not there doing the work. If it comes down to items that no one needs or can use or wants, everyone can roll for it. Whatever the winner does with it is none of my business. But I will not hand over loot to some one that is farming items for his friends or his guild. Why not bring your guild there and do it yourself?
Point of fact, EVERYONE NEEDS MONEY, that's why they call it money (Danny DeVito, The Heist). There is not a single player that doesn't need money. For improving trade skills or upgrading equipment or finally getting a horse.
And since everyone needs money, that means it is the LOWEST common reason why people should get to roll for drops. There fore, Greed, in my book should never be counted as a reason for who gets what loot.
Another growing trend is people looting for a friend. This happens alot on the Firiona Vie, the server I play on. Example: me and some friends were in Great Divide, pulling Shardwurms. We took in a ranger (who was a bad puller on top of everything). Everything is going fine, when the necro spell drops. None of these spells sell for a lot. But there is a quest in Plane of Knowledge that requires all foue spells from the 4 different pure casters that drop there. I asked if I could have the spell and explained why, for a quest. His reply was, well, I have a necro friend that could use this spell. He then said Well, need before greed. I do have a need for it, I need it for a quest. I explained the quest again. He kept saying, yes but my friend can actually use the spell, not just lose it for turning it in. I pointed out to him that I was the one here fighting and have a need for the spell and that over rules his friends need for the spell, who I was NOT here, fighting the shardwurms. My solution was that everyone in the group roll for it, and if he loses the roll, and should another copy of the spell drop he can have it without rolling. He lost the roll, and the person that did win gave me the spell. Next shardwurm the same spell dropped. Figures.
I am not fighting mobs to give the loot to someone elses friend who is not there doing the work. If it comes down to items that no one needs or can use or wants, everyone can roll for it. Whatever the winner does with it is none of my business. But I will not hand over loot to some one that is farming items for his friends or his guild. Why not bring your guild there and do it yourself?
You're correct this has a 36% haste effect. which...besides a 40% is the highest you can find on EQ atm. Greats stats as well, making this a great item for a melee class. Or any other class for that matter.
39 posts
41% is the haste on POA quest belt
Going to try and put an end to this on who should get to be in the roll for this item. Becasue in the end, it'll be really the ML and raid leaders descion on who gets to roll for what items. If the raid leader is fair, he/she will let everyone in on a item that they need preferably if it'll be a upgrade for them. A CoF would definantly be a upgrade for tanks/melee classes as its one of the best non no drop items in the game. Again if you want in on the roll for the Cof, send a tell to the ML. That's how it usualy works. And if guilds are smart, they'll let only thier tanks Warriors/palys/sk, in on the roll for this item first. If your on a pick up raid, it'll be the raid leader and ml decion. Ask them how looting is going to work. If you don't like the rules, don't join the raid. Now I know this won't end the rant on who'll get to roll on this thing, so speak up and let me see what ya have to say :)
Btw This cloak is worth about 70-80k on Emarr, bout the same price as a cobalt bp.
Edited, Wed Jun 25 10:37:27 2003
Btw This cloak is worth about 70-80k on Emarr, bout the same price as a cobalt bp.
Edited, Wed Jun 25 10:37:27 2003
I play a necro. Very little loot is necro-usable. There are some slots (waist, shoulders) where there are few enough significantly good items for the slot that post-44 or so, you are competing with everyone else for 5 or 6 items in the entire game!
If this item were to drop on a raid that I joined on, I'd want a chance to roll on it, and I'd be very up-front: it's just cash. I have no intention of doing anything but selling it, but I need the dang cash so that I can buy an item that will make me more useful on the next raid (probably fueling that cleric's CHs at the end of the raid when their mana supply has run out).
Why is it altruistic for an MA to want this for the haste, but it's greedy for me to want it so I can buy something with a high-level focus effect? I'll admit that it hurts when you see one of the best items for your class come up, and because it's droppable, everyone wants in. If Zladicar's Heart went by in this way, it would be a hard pill to swallow.
However, I'd be willing to swallow it if I happened to have a CoF that I could trade to the tank that got Z'sH :)
If this item were to drop on a raid that I joined on, I'd want a chance to roll on it, and I'd be very up-front: it's just cash. I have no intention of doing anything but selling it, but I need the dang cash so that I can buy an item that will make me more useful on the next raid (probably fueling that cleric's CHs at the end of the raid when their mana supply has run out).
Why is it altruistic for an MA to want this for the haste, but it's greedy for me to want it so I can buy something with a high-level focus effect? I'll admit that it hurts when you see one of the best items for your class come up, and because it's droppable, everyone wants in. If Zladicar's Heart went by in this way, it would be a hard pill to swallow.
However, I'd be willing to swallow it if I happened to have a CoF that I could trade to the tank that got Z'sH :)
you are being honest, thats pretty cool. but would you take it the same if some warrior won a copy of your rare level 59 pet, with the sole idea that he can sell it to buy gear for him? if melee are not winning these items, and not allowed to roll on other items how are we going to raise the 50-80k you will charge for this?
i have no problem with greed before need, as long as it's on all items, not just some. if it's worth cash, droppable, and uber melee items are open to the raid i would bid on spells, heck yeah.
i have no problem with greed before need, as long as it's on all items, not just some. if it's worth cash, droppable, and uber melee items are open to the raid i would bid on spells, heck yeah.
1 post
Anyone know what the Percent haste on CoF is ??
and do you think it would be better than FBSS ?
For the only class to play on EQ (Iky Monk)
and do you think it would be better than FBSS ?
For the only class to play on EQ (Iky Monk)
5 posts
36% haste I believe is the rating...considering it has great ac and stats, it blows FBSS out of the water...no real comparison.
#REDACTED,
Posted: Sep 14 2002 at 9:17 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Erloy, if you're still argueing with me, then i don't think you read my post.
5 posts
you say everyone can make cash soloing like you huh
ever played a warrior?
you say you spend 1k a week on ports kei
im lucky if i can even make 1k a week
im a 42nd warrior and if you think i can solo mobs to sell there loot please let me know which mobs i can solo that have decent loot
ever played a warrior?
you say you spend 1k a week on ports kei
im lucky if i can even make 1k a week
im a 42nd warrior and if you think i can solo mobs to sell there loot please let me know which mobs i can solo that have decent loot
1 post
Ok im here looking up the item for a friend to see if it drops anywhere else other than Naggy, I won mine on my first Naggy raid with a 48th lvl monk.I have no problem with anyone rolling on any item unless it is class specific, i have only one thing to say to everyone who has quoted on the NBG or the GBN comments above... its a freaking game people, i tell ya what, go turn off your computer and pick up a book and read or go out and meet some one new, everyone is arguing about nothing, its a game..get a life, and to all you casters who want to roll to sell the item, i say go for it! All those Melees out there who ***** about it probably have never had to play a high level caster and had to have bought high level spells before. To all you casters out there, dont be wishy washy, if a raid lets you roll on a item that you plan on selling, dont ***** about it when you go on another raid and a Melee wants to roll on a caster item. Please people its just a game, anyways you can buy half the crap you want on Players auction now anyways..please do the world a favor..relax and enjoy the game. If you get stressed out about a picture on the screen that can make your character move faster or get more money, i promise you, you will get more enjoyment out of spending time with your family, take my advise or not, i really dont care (sorry for any misspelled words or any incorect grammer)
12 posts
Everyone. Yes, EVERYONE should roll on all items that are not NO DROP on open raids. NBG does not apply except on guild raids.
All casters should roll on melee items and all melee should roll on caster items.
Casters NEED good melee items to sell for suitable upgrades to their caster equipment. Likewise, melee NEED good caster items to sell for suitable upgrades to their melee equipment.
To exclude a caster from a melee item roll is GREED on the melee players' part. To exclude a melee from a caster item roll is GREED on the caster players' part.
Stop the whining and debating. Go level up, join a guild and raid with them if you want to use NBG rules.
Kulman Fistticuffs
Epic Grandmaster of Agema
Ayonae Ro
Elroy = Greedy Newb.
/rofl Why would a monk (yes grandmaster = 60monk)need that eyepatch? You show yourself as greedy by not agreeing / understanding what I said. All items are an upgrade to all classes if they are droppable. They can be sold to fund upgrade items for the winner if the winner can't use them. NO I don't have a CoF and no I don't have better. I just understand what reality is for casters and the cost of their spells. Some level 60 spells are 100k. You think they could make that buffing and rezzing? NEWB FOOL if you do. If i lost to a caster on a CoF, I'd congratulate them and move on to the next item. Like I said above. NBG rolling on items in open raids IS greed. PURE GREED. NBG is for Guild raids only no ifs, ands or buts.
Edited, Sat Sep 7 22:50:44 2002
All casters should roll on melee items and all melee should roll on caster items.
Casters NEED good melee items to sell for suitable upgrades to their caster equipment. Likewise, melee NEED good caster items to sell for suitable upgrades to their melee equipment.
To exclude a caster from a melee item roll is GREED on the melee players' part. To exclude a melee from a caster item roll is GREED on the caster players' part.
Stop the whining and debating. Go level up, join a guild and raid with them if you want to use NBG rules.
Kulman Fistticuffs
Epic Grandmaster of Agema
Ayonae Ro
Elroy = Greedy Newb.
/rofl Why would a monk (yes grandmaster = 60monk)need that eyepatch? You show yourself as greedy by not agreeing / understanding what I said. All items are an upgrade to all classes if they are droppable. They can be sold to fund upgrade items for the winner if the winner can't use them. NO I don't have a CoF and no I don't have better. I just understand what reality is for casters and the cost of their spells. Some level 60 spells are 100k. You think they could make that buffing and rezzing? NEWB FOOL if you do. If i lost to a caster on a CoF, I'd congratulate them and move on to the next item. Like I said above. NBG rolling on items in open raids IS greed. PURE GREED. NBG is for Guild raids only no ifs, ands or buts.
Edited, Sat Sep 7 22:50:44 2002
44 posts
yup yup
and i hope i win that role on that Item you deperately need/want too.
Ill sell it to you for 100Kpp
that sound fair?
Casters need to sell melee items. Whats that ganga you smokin man, can i have some?
PP income for class specific abilities(not everone charges i know but you could if you wanted.)
Clerics get PP for res
Druids/Wizzy get PP for ports
Chanters get PP for C, 1,2 3
Necros get PP for Summon corpse
Shammy get PP for those wondeful buffs
Wizzy Manaburn crew cant even imagine the PP they get
Melees get PP for????
Monks maybe for CR
Pallys maybe for low exp Res
SK maybe for Summon corpse
Beasties? dont know what they are good for except soloing.(havent played one)
Warrior: are useless for PP (yea i am one)
If its all/all item sure why not roll on it, i agree you have a right to,
however its only a matter of courtacy and common sense to divvy up loot to the classes that can put it to the most use when equiped. Besides you dont like the loot rules, dont join the raid.
Maybe ill roll on that Tobrins Mystical eyepatch next time it drops. https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=1825 its all/all too. oh what is that a different story??
Elroy Bungeecleaver
51 Warrior of An Rach
Cazic Thule server
Reply thread 9/9
"Elroy = Greedy Newb."
/sigh doesnt matter to comment.
The only reason i replied to your thread, as you were at least noble enough to not post /anon.
never said casters cant roll on it.
if you 'll look i said if its all/all why not everyone roll. my point was NOT about who gets to, varient said its all/all so why not everyone roll. i even said if you dont like the loot rules dont join. a philosphy i stick to.
the point becomes grey when it becomes a matter econoics over game play.
why would a caster roll on an item that a melee could immediately put to good use?
It appears on many threads that the issue of selling "uber gear" gets grey when a melee rolls on that high level spell, or that wis/int item. suddenly the whole caster group stand up and say "NAY' you cant roll on it you cant use it.
you said it yourself: " 'rofl Why would a monk (yes grandmaster = 60monk)need that eyepatch"
your right, indeed why would a druid need CoF?
Every spell drops ive seen are given away to the class that can use them, even if they are a stranger. but thats just prolly me and the people i play with. it appears we are NOT the norm.
Anyway the root of my point was that you stated that it was necessary for a caster to farm/sell/etc melee gear for cash.
I pointed out that was not true. When casters need cash, they have utility spells that can/do/etc they charge for.
Druids used to have the best of it with ports, but thats changing. ive paid upwards of 100 pp just so i can freekin get to a zone to play. but thats another beef. Time vs PP should not be part of a "game".
I personally dont like selling anything. but maybe you've convinced me, now that the bazaar is so great. Think ill hit skyfire this weekend.
Mr Knowsow 47 Shaman, you know more about being a shammy than i do, so 47 is great. great to even see youre proud enough to post without /anon. and i can tell your passionate about being a caster but, im sorry that youve never made much, but by your screen name i guess you usually ignore people or tell em off when they ask for buffs.
But you could was my point. I pay for buffs outside of groups, so maybe your the dumbass.
Mr. illovich
you have a very good point about carrying items back. hadnt really concidered that. i do mule items for my casters and /split i wouldnt say i make more with my warrior. i usally supply my casters in group with PP upfront for those components. however, i make more with my alt cleric than i do with my warrior. but that is my experience. and your right 20 pp a port is a lot of porting. 60K up front would be great, however day to day PP usuage melees dont have the abilities inherent to casters. I certainly didnt intend to have this post go so far. [:eek]
Best reply to all was by Armote, yup its a game that we should get back to playing.
Edited, Mon Sep 9 16:21:54 2002
and i hope i win that role on that Item you deperately need/want too.
Ill sell it to you for 100Kpp
that sound fair?
Casters need to sell melee items. Whats that ganga you smokin man, can i have some?
PP income for class specific abilities(not everone charges i know but you could if you wanted.)
Clerics get PP for res
Druids/Wizzy get PP for ports
Chanters get PP for C, 1,2 3
Necros get PP for Summon corpse
Shammy get PP for those wondeful buffs
Wizzy Manaburn crew cant even imagine the PP they get
Melees get PP for????
Monks maybe for CR
Pallys maybe for low exp Res
SK maybe for Summon corpse
Beasties? dont know what they are good for except soloing.(havent played one)
Warrior: are useless for PP (yea i am one)
If its all/all item sure why not roll on it, i agree you have a right to,
however its only a matter of courtacy and common sense to divvy up loot to the classes that can put it to the most use when equiped. Besides you dont like the loot rules, dont join the raid.
Maybe ill roll on that Tobrins Mystical eyepatch next time it drops. https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=1825 its all/all too. oh what is that a different story??
Elroy Bungeecleaver
51 Warrior of An Rach
Cazic Thule server
Reply thread 9/9
"Elroy = Greedy Newb."
/sigh doesnt matter to comment.
The only reason i replied to your thread, as you were at least noble enough to not post /anon.
never said casters cant roll on it.
if you 'll look i said if its all/all why not everyone roll. my point was NOT about who gets to, varient said its all/all so why not everyone roll. i even said if you dont like the loot rules dont join. a philosphy i stick to.
the point becomes grey when it becomes a matter econoics over game play.
why would a caster roll on an item that a melee could immediately put to good use?
It appears on many threads that the issue of selling "uber gear" gets grey when a melee rolls on that high level spell, or that wis/int item. suddenly the whole caster group stand up and say "NAY' you cant roll on it you cant use it.
you said it yourself: " 'rofl Why would a monk (yes grandmaster = 60monk)need that eyepatch"
your right, indeed why would a druid need CoF?
Every spell drops ive seen are given away to the class that can use them, even if they are a stranger. but thats just prolly me and the people i play with. it appears we are NOT the norm.
Anyway the root of my point was that you stated that it was necessary for a caster to farm/sell/etc melee gear for cash.
I pointed out that was not true. When casters need cash, they have utility spells that can/do/etc they charge for.
Druids used to have the best of it with ports, but thats changing. ive paid upwards of 100 pp just so i can freekin get to a zone to play. but thats another beef. Time vs PP should not be part of a "game".
I personally dont like selling anything. but maybe you've convinced me, now that the bazaar is so great. Think ill hit skyfire this weekend.
Mr Knowsow 47 Shaman, you know more about being a shammy than i do, so 47 is great. great to even see youre proud enough to post without /anon. and i can tell your passionate about being a caster but, im sorry that youve never made much, but by your screen name i guess you usually ignore people or tell em off when they ask for buffs.
But you could was my point. I pay for buffs outside of groups, so maybe your the dumbass.
Mr. illovich
you have a very good point about carrying items back. hadnt really concidered that. i do mule items for my casters and /split i wouldnt say i make more with my warrior. i usally supply my casters in group with PP upfront for those components. however, i make more with my alt cleric than i do with my warrior. but that is my experience. and your right 20 pp a port is a lot of porting. 60K up front would be great, however day to day PP usuage melees dont have the abilities inherent to casters. I certainly didnt intend to have this post go so far. [:eek]
Best reply to all was by Armote, yup its a game that we should get back to playing.
Edited, Mon Sep 9 16:21:54 2002
"yup yup
and i hope i win that role on that Item you deperately need/want too. "
I find that most people I meet desperately want to make serious cash. At 54, cash is still pretty hard to come by. The ideas expressed about how casters can make fabulous cash and melees are stuck are pretty fatuous. I play on two accounts and have all slots full. My warrior makes way more than my druid ever did in the thirties range becasue they can actually loot 20 FS weapons and carry them back to town to sell...or whatever, I think you get my point (oin other words, don't post how at an average 130 str, a normal warrior would be encumbered after 14 FS weapons).
I would say that while some classes are more money efficient than others (depending on level), most can make money.
The main way that I know for people to make money--lots of it, quick--is to get the so called phat lewtz. And sell them. There is nothing greedy about open roll raids...for example, I went on a Dragon Necropolis last night. As a 54 druid, there's nont much that really interests me in terms of loot in that zone, and on a raid you won't get much experience ( I got less than a blue in 4 hours). So why would I go? After adventure (it was fun, let's be real), it was the possiblity of getting a phase spider carapace (sells for about 7k, I think) etc from a drop. You might think that'as greedy, but most of my spells, almost all the good ones, are rare drops from random NPCs in various zones on Kunark, Velious and Luclin. I need about 25k to get my 54 spells, and probably more for my 55 spells.
Believe me, 25k will take me a long time to make doing ports for 20p a piece. So yeah, I should get a shot at an item that I will "just" sell, becasue I'll turn around and use that "filthy lucre" and buy the spells that I need to be a viable soloer and grouper through the next couple levels.
and i hope i win that role on that Item you deperately need/want too. "
I find that most people I meet desperately want to make serious cash. At 54, cash is still pretty hard to come by. The ideas expressed about how casters can make fabulous cash and melees are stuck are pretty fatuous. I play on two accounts and have all slots full. My warrior makes way more than my druid ever did in the thirties range becasue they can actually loot 20 FS weapons and carry them back to town to sell...or whatever, I think you get my point (oin other words, don't post how at an average 130 str, a normal warrior would be encumbered after 14 FS weapons).
I would say that while some classes are more money efficient than others (depending on level), most can make money.
The main way that I know for people to make money--lots of it, quick--is to get the so called phat lewtz. And sell them. There is nothing greedy about open roll raids...for example, I went on a Dragon Necropolis last night. As a 54 druid, there's nont much that really interests me in terms of loot in that zone, and on a raid you won't get much experience ( I got less than a blue in 4 hours). So why would I go? After adventure (it was fun, let's be real), it was the possiblity of getting a phase spider carapace (sells for about 7k, I think) etc from a drop. You might think that'as greedy, but most of my spells, almost all the good ones, are rare drops from random NPCs in various zones on Kunark, Velious and Luclin. I need about 25k to get my 54 spells, and probably more for my 55 spells.
Believe me, 25k will take me a long time to make doing ports for 20p a piece. So yeah, I should get a shot at an item that I will "just" sell, becasue I'll turn around and use that "filthy lucre" and buy the spells that I need to be a viable soloer and grouper through the next couple levels.
Open raids=Greed role.. Or no one will even wanna come..
Greed is such a bad term tho.. NBG..... The Funny part is.. open NBG raids.. Is GREEDY!
Unless there REALly is Fair loot all around, It should be greed role
Guild raids= guild raids.. NBG of Course applies....
.. Dont spaz at me or nothin .. remember its just a game not a lifestyle.. 2 years from now u wont even be playin eq=)
Greed is such a bad term tho.. NBG..... The Funny part is.. open NBG raids.. Is GREEDY!
Unless there REALly is Fair loot all around, It should be greed role
Guild raids= guild raids.. NBG of Course applies....
.. Dont spaz at me or nothin .. remember its just a game not a lifestyle.. 2 years from now u wont even be playin eq=)
6 posts
You need to wake up dumbass.
MOST people will not pay very much for sows/ports/etc.
In all my buffing days as a shaman, I've gotten maybe 50pp.
Casters don't have an advantage in loot, we have a disadvantage.
Look at Naggys loot tables.
Go to each item, and check out how good it is, what it should sell for (no, not was allakhazam says it should sell for because those prices are incorrect)...now tell me, what items can casters get to drop for them? Our sucky weapons?
N O T H I N G
Naggys loot tables are as follows, for all I care:
Bag (good for monks and weak casters. No one else needs it except as cash loot. Why do ogre warriors get to roll on this?)
Scale (Good for Bards and Warriors. In your happy world bards and warriors would roll on this.)
CoF (Uber for Melee classes, but still good for casters. 50hp, 15svf, and 9 agi are all things a caster would want. But still, this is a melee only item. Well, I would EASILY replace my Acrylia Studded Cloak with this - Acrylia Studded Cloak is pretty much a staple for wis casters. I will not replace it with any dropable gear for under 50k.)
So out of everything Naggy drops worth rolling on (the other stuff is sucks...I would not use any of it, I will always have better), Casters get a Bag worth 4k. Well, I would roll on the bag, and then show it to a monk, and destroy it, because I just wasted 4 hours of my time killing naggy for an OPEN raid, where I can't loot anything. Because guess what? In 4 hours, I can make about 12k.
In conclusion, Naggy is NOT worth open raiding if casters can't roll on CoF.
Am I being greedy? No way. Being greedy would be rolling on the scale. Being greedy would be me, a Shaman, rolling on the Drum. Being greedy, is rolling on things other people would USE, not sell. Well guess what. If I was a Melee class, I would sell that cloak before you could congradulate me on the roll. Why? because for Sixty-thousand platinum, I can buy and RBG, and LSoEE, and a Snowchipper. You tell me. Will that 6% haste do more damage when I'm using Centi LSs, or should I ditch the 6% haste and equip myself with weapons MUCH better. Hell, for 60k I could buy myself a Narandi's Lance. And you know what? I'd rather use the lance and SCHW then a CoF and Centi LSs, and you would to. As a Melee, you will also sell the cloak. The hole in my logic is that if what I'm saying is true (which it is, this is the only possible fault), then no one would buy the cloak. Well, if the cloak could be won buy 60th lvl chars, then as a caster I would bow down and let the warrior who already has upgraded his gear to par with CoF roll on it, because he will use it.
On a Naggy raid, no one will use it, they will sell it.
NOW
Back to the point:
The cloak should be rolled on by casters because we have the same plans as warriors do for it. SELL.
Moving on to Naggy and her Eyepatch/cloak.
Based on your reasoning (well, you don't have any reasoning, you have a computer and an opinion) Only casters should get to roll on the Eyepatch.
Well, I tell you what: if I win an item worth more then 20k, I am going to sell it. With this being the case, you should get to have a shot at looting it to, because you're just going to sell it.
Now, how am I being greedy here? Because I want to make money where a melee could possibly gain? Yes, that may be a little greedy (I don't want to waste 4 hours on a Naggy raid for no chance of anything), but I think YOU are being the greedy one. I mean come on. If you melee's had it your way, CoCW would be melee roll only "because it has haste". Now I know you would turn around and sell your CoCW, because for less you can buy an RBB which is better.
If things continue the way they sometimes are, with both cloaks being melee only, and the eyepatch being caster only, what reason do I, as a Shaman, have for coming to your raid? So I can take a chance against the other 90% of people there (what classes can't cast spells? Warriors, Rogues, and Monks. Everyone else gets to roll on the eyepatch) at winning an eyepatch that sells for LESS then the cloak you have to with 60% of the people there? (Classes not allowed to roll on cloaks: Mag, enc, wiz, sham, cler - which am i forgetting? - a good 40% of EQ players) This doesn't sound very fair to casters.
So why else would I come? To waste my time? Nope...To help all the punk azz melees get some rich? How about hell no.
So in your world, where the cloaks are melee only, I hope you are very good at bind wound, because casters wont show up.
The only way to make it *fair*, is to allow everyone to roll on everything worth 5k or more (5k being the point where I really start to care about the money at hand), to allow the classes who need the epic items for their epics loot the epic items, and for the classes/races listed on everything else to roll on everything else.
The way it is right now, melees make their money by ******** at us casters for long enough that we let them have their loots, while we...get stuck with nothing.
The NBG loot rules only work with closed raids, because casters (who have very little loot drop on raids...-- trust me on this, I looked in to the whole Plane of Fear and the ONLY items I would want there are off of CT, Chromodrake, or a Golem (not whats actually on the golem, but the child that spawns after him for my epic)--where as melee classes get fairly uber armor and weapon drops.) get the shaft in the azz with them.
Knowsow
47 Shaman
*also* Don't try and say "what do you know Knowsow, you're just lvl 47" (which I know at least half the melee's will), then you can come over to Dro and drool on my armor, because you don't need lvls to have knowledge or loot, you just have to know what yer doing.
MOST people will not pay very much for sows/ports/etc.
In all my buffing days as a shaman, I've gotten maybe 50pp.
Casters don't have an advantage in loot, we have a disadvantage.
Look at Naggys loot tables.
Go to each item, and check out how good it is, what it should sell for (no, not was allakhazam says it should sell for because those prices are incorrect)...now tell me, what items can casters get to drop for them? Our sucky weapons?
N O T H I N G
Naggys loot tables are as follows, for all I care:
Bag (good for monks and weak casters. No one else needs it except as cash loot. Why do ogre warriors get to roll on this?)
Scale (Good for Bards and Warriors. In your happy world bards and warriors would roll on this.)
CoF (Uber for Melee classes, but still good for casters. 50hp, 15svf, and 9 agi are all things a caster would want. But still, this is a melee only item. Well, I would EASILY replace my Acrylia Studded Cloak with this - Acrylia Studded Cloak is pretty much a staple for wis casters. I will not replace it with any dropable gear for under 50k.)
So out of everything Naggy drops worth rolling on (the other stuff is sucks...I would not use any of it, I will always have better), Casters get a Bag worth 4k. Well, I would roll on the bag, and then show it to a monk, and destroy it, because I just wasted 4 hours of my time killing naggy for an OPEN raid, where I can't loot anything. Because guess what? In 4 hours, I can make about 12k.
In conclusion, Naggy is NOT worth open raiding if casters can't roll on CoF.
Am I being greedy? No way. Being greedy would be rolling on the scale. Being greedy would be me, a Shaman, rolling on the Drum. Being greedy, is rolling on things other people would USE, not sell. Well guess what. If I was a Melee class, I would sell that cloak before you could congradulate me on the roll. Why? because for Sixty-thousand platinum, I can buy and RBG, and LSoEE, and a Snowchipper. You tell me. Will that 6% haste do more damage when I'm using Centi LSs, or should I ditch the 6% haste and equip myself with weapons MUCH better. Hell, for 60k I could buy myself a Narandi's Lance. And you know what? I'd rather use the lance and SCHW then a CoF and Centi LSs, and you would to. As a Melee, you will also sell the cloak. The hole in my logic is that if what I'm saying is true (which it is, this is the only possible fault), then no one would buy the cloak. Well, if the cloak could be won buy 60th lvl chars, then as a caster I would bow down and let the warrior who already has upgraded his gear to par with CoF roll on it, because he will use it.
On a Naggy raid, no one will use it, they will sell it.
NOW
Back to the point:
The cloak should be rolled on by casters because we have the same plans as warriors do for it. SELL.
Moving on to Naggy and her Eyepatch/cloak.
Based on your reasoning (well, you don't have any reasoning, you have a computer and an opinion) Only casters should get to roll on the Eyepatch.
Well, I tell you what: if I win an item worth more then 20k, I am going to sell it. With this being the case, you should get to have a shot at looting it to, because you're just going to sell it.
Now, how am I being greedy here? Because I want to make money where a melee could possibly gain? Yes, that may be a little greedy (I don't want to waste 4 hours on a Naggy raid for no chance of anything), but I think YOU are being the greedy one. I mean come on. If you melee's had it your way, CoCW would be melee roll only "because it has haste". Now I know you would turn around and sell your CoCW, because for less you can buy an RBB which is better.
If things continue the way they sometimes are, with both cloaks being melee only, and the eyepatch being caster only, what reason do I, as a Shaman, have for coming to your raid? So I can take a chance against the other 90% of people there (what classes can't cast spells? Warriors, Rogues, and Monks. Everyone else gets to roll on the eyepatch) at winning an eyepatch that sells for LESS then the cloak you have to with 60% of the people there? (Classes not allowed to roll on cloaks: Mag, enc, wiz, sham, cler - which am i forgetting? - a good 40% of EQ players) This doesn't sound very fair to casters.
So why else would I come? To waste my time? Nope...To help all the punk azz melees get some rich? How about hell no.
So in your world, where the cloaks are melee only, I hope you are very good at bind wound, because casters wont show up.
The only way to make it *fair*, is to allow everyone to roll on everything worth 5k or more (5k being the point where I really start to care about the money at hand), to allow the classes who need the epic items for their epics loot the epic items, and for the classes/races listed on everything else to roll on everything else.
The way it is right now, melees make their money by ******** at us casters for long enough that we let them have their loots, while we...get stuck with nothing.
The NBG loot rules only work with closed raids, because casters (who have very little loot drop on raids...-- trust me on this, I looked in to the whole Plane of Fear and the ONLY items I would want there are off of CT, Chromodrake, or a Golem (not whats actually on the golem, but the child that spawns after him for my epic)--where as melee classes get fairly uber armor and weapon drops.) get the shaft in the azz with them.
Knowsow
47 Shaman
*also* Don't try and say "what do you know Knowsow, you're just lvl 47" (which I know at least half the melee's will), then you can come over to Dro and drool on my armor, because you don't need lvls to have knowledge or loot, you just have to know what yer doing.
I agree. Pickup raid = Greed before Need. What item does Naggy drop that casters would *actually* use? Maybe the bag.. everyone wants the CoF from Naggy and RBB from Vox. If you try and make a pickup raid for NBG, good luck getting buffers and clerics to join up.
I lost the roll on a shoulder item from Ixiblat Fer in BW to a MAGE! The item is definately for monks/rogues but since it was usable for mage/wiz they got to roll on it. Sure I'm bitter since the mage doesn't really need the dex/agi and won't ever use it but that's the way life goes.
I lost the roll on a shoulder item from Ixiblat Fer in BW to a MAGE! The item is definately for monks/rogues but since it was usable for mage/wiz they got to roll on it. Sure I'm bitter since the mage doesn't really need the dex/agi and won't ever use it but that's the way life goes.
Aye I agree - open raids need to be open rolls. And for guilds using NBG I am not sure I agree with that either for this reason. Most higher guilds use a point system not a NBG and they are big and keep members because of that. Heres why: I attend 10 raids and get a few upgrades then on the 11th a member joins for the 1st time and an item drops that is an upgrade for me but because because the new guy is still wearing some pre-kunark crap and it is a huge upgarde he automatically gets it. There would be know incentive to attend raids other then when there was 1 item you wanted, etc. In a point system I can decide how many points that item is worth to me and bid that amount the guy that attends 1 raid a month has no where near the points I have so the item will be mine.
One exception I have seen that works and is fair I think. The Bags that are really the best for monks should not be only monk rolled on but allow the monks who want to agree to trade there Tinker Bag for it. If more then 1 monk wants and is willing to trade in his tinker have those monks roll then put the tinker bag up for open roll for all. The dragon bag and tinker bag only have one difefrence and thats 0.6 weight difference which is only important at all for a monk.
One exception I have seen that works and is fair I think. The Bags that are really the best for monks should not be only monk rolled on but allow the monks who want to agree to trade there Tinker Bag for it. If more then 1 monk wants and is willing to trade in his tinker have those monks roll then put the tinker bag up for open roll for all. The dragon bag and tinker bag only have one difefrence and thats 0.6 weight difference which is only important at all for a monk.
a couple of things...
1. Magi making money?? I didn't see ANYONE say how magi make all their money....hmm, wonder why that was? cuz there isn't one. We rely primarily on loot to make cash...
and don't EVEN say that our focus items make money, i can't remember one time where anyone gave me a red cent, and not that I asked for it from them, but that's just my point again.
2. Magi not using dex. i didn't check if your post was pre-luclin or not, but the spell crits? they run off dex......who the hell doesn't want to crit? =)
1. Magi making money?? I didn't see ANYONE say how magi make all their money....hmm, wonder why that was? cuz there isn't one. We rely primarily on loot to make cash...
and don't EVEN say that our focus items make money, i can't remember one time where anyone gave me a red cent, and not that I asked for it from them, but that's just my point again.
2. Magi not using dex. i didn't check if your post was pre-luclin or not, but the spell crits? they run off dex......who the hell doesn't want to crit? =)
9 posts
Rofl all you greed before need sayers? you know who you are. Ya greedy little horn balls LOL
Good luck finding a guild that will have You! LOL
To that oh so ubah cleric who thinks he should be able to sell a cof because of his valuable serveice I cant help but laugh.
You are the weakest link dodoe and can be replaced LOL
Anyone who thinks greed before need is good is an idiot who usually spends more time whineing than they do playing.
You would not last the recruitment process in most high end guilds lol certainly not mine.
Any successfull guild knows that Not only is it Need before Greed its Greatest need before greed.
So if a COF drops and 6 wariors are there then the 6 roll if the winner has a haste item then the other 5 roll on that and the casters can sit and like it or get the hell out.
You dont like it leave cause you can be replaced easily enough foof.
Casters HAVE mobs which drop thier items that mellee get to sit and watch. Velks..THO..and a ton more!
Geebus if you are so greedy and pissy that you have to be able to roll on something you can't use them you will never find a high end guild that will have you until you change your tune.
Lol what foofs you are who obviously have never had a character over 50. And if you have and you still think that way then you now know WHY your 50+ is guildless.
Good luck finding a guild that will have You! LOL
To that oh so ubah cleric who thinks he should be able to sell a cof because of his valuable serveice I cant help but laugh.
You are the weakest link dodoe and can be replaced LOL
Anyone who thinks greed before need is good is an idiot who usually spends more time whineing than they do playing.
You would not last the recruitment process in most high end guilds lol certainly not mine.
Any successfull guild knows that Not only is it Need before Greed its Greatest need before greed.
So if a COF drops and 6 wariors are there then the 6 roll if the winner has a haste item then the other 5 roll on that and the casters can sit and like it or get the hell out.
You dont like it leave cause you can be replaced easily enough foof.
Casters HAVE mobs which drop thier items that mellee get to sit and watch. Velks..THO..and a ton more!
Geebus if you are so greedy and pissy that you have to be able to roll on something you can't use them you will never find a high end guild that will have you until you change your tune.
Lol what foofs you are who obviously have never had a character over 50. And if you have and you still think that way then you now know WHY your 50+ is guildless.
I think you miss their point. Nobody is saying GUILD raids should be open roll. What they are saying is pickup raids should be.
Perhaps you've lead such a sheltered existence in your guild that you are not aware that often, weak mobs like Nagafen are often taken down by pickup raids. When people join these pickup raids, and waste an entire evening while the thing is staged, they expect some CHANCE of loot.
I have spent whole days on item specific raids for guild member epics, with no expectation of reward. I will not, however, waste my time on nagafen if everything is reserved for melees only.
Recently, while camping the SMR in lower guk (for a guild rogue who didn't get a quill when we dropped the general), I started receiving tells from a pickup naggy raid group. I was on my 51 cleric (non anon) and had people begging me for hours to join their raid. The later tells actually announced that all loot was open roll, including CoF. Once they did that, they must have gotten some takers, because the tells stopped soon after. until then, nobody bit. IF I had not been helping a guildy, I might have gone, for open rolls. Otherwise, I just don't do naggy, unless I bring my own group of guild melees. If THEY can roll, then I'm happy. I benefit, or my guild benefits, I go. If not, I pass.
I should note that the raid leader in the above mentioned naggy raid had stopped accepting melees several hours before they got enough healers.
Perhaps you've lead such a sheltered existence in your guild that you are not aware that often, weak mobs like Nagafen are often taken down by pickup raids. When people join these pickup raids, and waste an entire evening while the thing is staged, they expect some CHANCE of loot.
I have spent whole days on item specific raids for guild member epics, with no expectation of reward. I will not, however, waste my time on nagafen if everything is reserved for melees only.
Recently, while camping the SMR in lower guk (for a guild rogue who didn't get a quill when we dropped the general), I started receiving tells from a pickup naggy raid group. I was on my 51 cleric (non anon) and had people begging me for hours to join their raid. The later tells actually announced that all loot was open roll, including CoF. Once they did that, they must have gotten some takers, because the tells stopped soon after. until then, nobody bit. IF I had not been helping a guildy, I might have gone, for open rolls. Otherwise, I just don't do naggy, unless I bring my own group of guild melees. If THEY can roll, then I'm happy. I benefit, or my guild benefits, I go. If not, I pass.
I should note that the raid leader in the above mentioned naggy raid had stopped accepting melees several hours before they got enough healers.
#REDACTED,
Posted: Sep 02 2002 at 5:09 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I think its so rude when The Dragon raid leaders dont let casters roll on this. Its stupid.. I mean yes its a awesome item for the tanks, but cmon, a druid could SURE use it. How? sell it, get money and buy something they CAN use. I think this is true especcially on this item. This is obviously the most wanted naggy drop, and most valuable, so its like the tanks get to roll on a 50k item, woo hoo!, while the druids n shamen get to roll on a crappy, 2k, hard to sell item!. Thats not very fair imho. Obviously this isnt true Everywhere else, but leaders, pls, let the casters roll on this too. (So what if they are gonna sell it! You Probably will too eventually) and BTW i play a Warrior, who iv gone on naggy raids with, so its not like im a greedy Cleric. Also, whats so bad about Selling a dragon drop item? Hi Mr.INeverGoOnDragonRaidsButISureDoCampHGSalot, why should u care if he goes on the raids or not, If he has the money, he obviously earned it..
#REDACTED,
Posted: Sep 02 2002 at 12:00 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) the idea of no drop over 10k would sure settle alot of problems huh.. lol.. i have to say i do agree with this.. or better yet.. maybe they could change haste items to classes spec. a little better.. like for example instead of this being all/all.. why not make it mellee.. i mean seriously.. why the heck would my wizzard want haste? thats a bit silly..
Personally, I feel items that could be worth more then 10k, potentially, should be no drop. Because the greed factor is discusting. Honestly. Your talking about "Well I need it to sell it" great, while the warrior goes "Oh, I was going to wear a cloak of flames, that I earned, with my own sweat and blood, but a druid won the roll." So now, the warrior turns around and goes "WTB Cloak of flames" druid, who went on the same raid goes "Gimme 50k bish." "Dude, I earned that cloak the same as you, wtf!?" Even if you choose to half price discount it, your still being a total ****. The guy earned it, and wants to put it on his back with pride, while you, want to sell it going "Oh, here ya go person who didn't fight the battle to possibly earn it in the first place." Hello world of idiots who've never been on a single dragon raid before but suddenly own dragon caliber loot. Sometimes I feel ALL items should be no drop, because the bought player is sickening, and half the time doesn't know **** about their class, and couldn't fight their way out of a 2 inch hole with a moss snake. Druids have no right to complain. The best druid armor I can think of, is Elyisian, and that drops off mobs DRUIDS SOLO. For crying out loud, the best armor you get is soloable by you. Only stuff better, is going into the world of VT, and CT.
38 posts
The FT3 boots are Called "Boots of Flowing Slime" , Drop in CT sewers, there RED look lil strange against my GReen SS Armor but my Druid LOVES them and NO they are NOT Caster Only, Some Melees can wear to (like Palys, Rangers etc). Not sure why A melee would Drop ton ac for them, and No Our Melee didnt roll on them, as we didnt roll on the MELEE earing that Drops in sewers, or the Wizard staff.
GL all on getting yours ;)
PS.. If any other Hunters of CT knows where "Shield of Striding" Drops Im very Interested in it. thxs
GL all on getting yours ;)
PS.. If any other Hunters of CT knows where "Shield of Striding" Drops Im very Interested in it. thxs
38 posts
The FT3 boots are Called "Boots of Flowing Slime" , Drop in CT sewers, there RED look lil strange against my GReen SS Armor but my Druid LOVES them and NO they are NOT Caster Only, Some Melees can wear to (like Palys, Rangers etc). Not sure why A melee would Drop ton ac for them, and No Our Melee didnt roll on them, as we didnt roll on the MELEE earing that Drops in sewers, or the Wizard staff.
GL all on getting yours ;)
PS.. If any other Hunters of CT knows where "Shield of Striding" Drops Im very Interested in it. thxs
GL all on getting yours ;)
PS.. If any other Hunters of CT knows where "Shield of Striding" Drops Im very Interested in it. thxs
i personally disagree with the CoF druid who wants to roll. Lets say i'm a 45 Ranger who is at the Raid ,and the CoF drops. hrmm lets think i'm 45 i have SCHW and i get my Epic soon and its 40% permanent haste hrmmm . well in my case i would rather see a it go to a Warrior who has a need for the haste item. i would not roll on it for the sheer though i could swipe 55k in a heartbeat on Povar.i would let the Warrior roll for it and keep out of the roll. As far as druids on raids ,your only invited to raids cause people feel bad for you. Any class can beat you in what they do I.E. Shamans Clerics,and Wizards. So thinking a druid is going to Roll on this is absurd; at least my guild has need before greed looting otherwise greedy casters would have all the tank items for sale and the tanks would have all the caster items.in closing all i have to say is GOD BLESS THE POINT SYSTEM. ok i'm done.
19 posts
before you say "oh, such and such's class has haste, don't let them roll" think about this
90% of the Epics SUCK now
i'm a rogue, and hanging below 53, waiting to hit a roll on this.. and yes, i have my epic.. but i don't care.. there are a half a dozen weaons that would make me bank the ragebringer in a heartbeat..
you need to take things like that into consideration as well
90% of the Epics SUCK now
i'm a rogue, and hanging below 53, waiting to hit a roll on this.. and yes, i have my epic.. but i don't care.. there are a half a dozen weaons that would make me bank the ragebringer in a heartbeat..
you need to take things like that into consideration as well
#REDACTED,
Posted: Aug 02 2002 at 8:37 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) IE wizards? lol im willing to bet a lvl 60 wiz with mana burn can beat the crap outta just about any class dood.. happens alot lol.. no IE about it.. and wiz are needed for porting to hate fear and internal ct.. id much rather have a wiz in the group then to many mellee anyday
Scholar
43 posts
. . . Says the wizard. What would your groupmates say I wonder.
#REDACTED,
Posted: Aug 17 2002 at 8:30 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) theyd agree.. 4 mellee is to much perfect grp in 50s is 3 tanks wiz cleric and either a chanter or druid.. depending on what kind of fighting you want to do..
6 posts
Just to set up credentials I've played a monk, a mage, and a cleric up to the 50+ range all non/mild twink but with a little low level PL'ing (something I'm mildly proud of). I'm a firm believer in Need before Greed and if the group or raid I am in (Guild or Non) does not, I'll walk. Because when the classes that gets the most benefit from this for immediate use (not as possible fuel for skill raising or to buy/trade for another item) it helps the group or raid I am in immediately as well as *EVERY SUBSEQUENT GROUP/RAID THEY JOIN*.
Its an important point so I want to repeat it. ***Need before Greed provides a character an immediate benefit to your group/raid and every other group/raid they participate in.***
That's the big point a lot of people seem to miss. EQ is (in my humble opinion) like driving on the freeway. We all want to get from point A to point B but its a cooperative effort. Sure, I wouldn't mind getting there a bit faster but I'll get there eventually as long as I keep driving. I'm of the opinion that if you don't believe in Need before Greed you are a self-centered prick. If you are only in a raid or group for your personal benefit thats your right but don't expect help from me or people of the same frame of mind. Thank you for reading my mindless random thoughts.
Its an important point so I want to repeat it. ***Need before Greed provides a character an immediate benefit to your group/raid and every other group/raid they participate in.***
That's the big point a lot of people seem to miss. EQ is (in my humble opinion) like driving on the freeway. We all want to get from point A to point B but its a cooperative effort. Sure, I wouldn't mind getting there a bit faster but I'll get there eventually as long as I keep driving. I'm of the opinion that if you don't believe in Need before Greed you are a self-centered prick. If you are only in a raid or group for your personal benefit thats your right but don't expect help from me or people of the same frame of mind. Thank you for reading my mindless random thoughts.
6 posts
Ack. Wish there was a way to adjust a post, or if there is, I wish I knew what it was.
<<<Additional: I found it.>>>
I just wanted to add that in my opinion one should treat all loot as no drop until everyone takes a pass on it. Then it should be regarded as all other vendorite, ie. how much is it worth. If you want to be completely fair to everyone, why not just roll on everything? No drop, who gets to loot what body, the rusty longsword, etc.
Oh, but I bet you didn't think of that since your only concerned is about what is fair for *YOU*.
Edited, Tue Jul 30 19:27:06 2002
<<<Additional: I found it.>>>
I just wanted to add that in my opinion one should treat all loot as no drop until everyone takes a pass on it. Then it should be regarded as all other vendorite, ie. how much is it worth. If you want to be completely fair to everyone, why not just roll on everything? No drop, who gets to loot what body, the rusty longsword, etc.
Oh, but I bet you didn't think of that since your only concerned is about what is fair for *YOU*.
Edited, Tue Jul 30 19:27:06 2002
1 post
I belive need before greed is ,well bull $^#%. I was on a naggy raid (druid) which we do so many peeps, each hasa a number then 1 to that number i wbut since it was no use to me, i could use it.THis is BS, because althought its not dirrect need, the 90 k on my sever would get me Stuff i need to help with raids.Pluss when then need a cleric next time on raid, to hell with them. I mean nbg is so over rated everyone NEEDS a item, and its no greed.Now twosuns who uses items to get so much cash in the game even tho he has the best gear ( aprox 2 million pp in bank ) who just want another 40 k in bank,yah thats greed.But to people who want ot sell it to get them better gear for mroe hten just one slot is okay.I mean what the hell does naggy drop that us druid need at 46, i mean hello,the heiro staff sucks for the level.
Edited, Thu Jul 18 14:19:25 2002
Edited, Thu Jul 18 14:19:25 2002
17 posts
Oviously it seems greed outweighs need Aamelrons.
Lets say you are on a raid and an awesome druid piece drops, how would you feel if someone who cant use the item was allowed to roll and beat you? Would your next post be the opposite of this one? If this was even romotely an organized raid you knew ahead of time that it was NBG and you faught your way through to Nagy playing by this rule, why change it at the end? Now if it was not NBG then at the end someone decided to change that rule, then you have a legitimate reason to complain, however let us not loose sight of what this is.... a game.
Lets say you are on a raid and an awesome druid piece drops, how would you feel if someone who cant use the item was allowed to roll and beat you? Would your next post be the opposite of this one? If this was even romotely an organized raid you knew ahead of time that it was NBG and you faught your way through to Nagy playing by this rule, why change it at the end? Now if it was not NBG then at the end someone decided to change that rule, then you have a legitimate reason to complain, however let us not loose sight of what this is.... a game.
The idea of NBG is need based on the item itself not how much the PP it is worth. On raids all cash items (ruby crowns, star ruby earrings, diamonds, BD's etc) and divided among the raiding party with prime players (leader, puller, MA, SA, ML) usually getting their pick on an extra item for the effort (and deaths in MA and pullers case) they are putting in.
Secondary to cash are items that are looted. Whether the item is worth 100pp or 100k is irrevelent at this time when NBG is in place. NBG means that if you win the roll on the item in question that you will replace what you are wearing in that slot with the item won. Resist gear does not count as NBG.
If you want to roll on the item based on the PP value of it, that is summed up in the word greed. On a NBG raid, Need has priority over Greed, and only people who Need the item to fill a slot (rather than sell), can roll. If nobody needs the item then the item becomes gravy loot (a term EQ players use to describe greed rolls ie stuff you sell or stick on twinks).
A druid obviously is not going to wear a cloak of flames. A Wizard is obviously not going to wear a cloak of flames. Therefor they don't need the item, reguardless of how much it is worth, and those who do need the item (to use not sell) are the only ones who roll. This is how most raids are done, and if you don't agree with it then don't raid anymore. Druids that roll on CoF IF allowed just usually lose the roll and their reputations along with it because they are just greedy ****'s wanting to ***** over their tanks, and us tanks remember that. Trust me, i think all MA's and SA's keep a list of people they don't like. I know some people on my friends list are anything but.
Same goes for druid epic items such as reavers for example. A Reaver is a 2 handed slashing sword that is usable by Warriors, Paladins, and Shadowknights that drop in City of Mist. Druids and Rangers need the swords as turn in piece for their epic. The result is no warriors, SKs, or pally's roll on reavers because i guess we just have more sense than that...unlike druids that want to roll on a Cloak of Flames.
Edited, Sun Jul 21 16:16:11 2002
Secondary to cash are items that are looted. Whether the item is worth 100pp or 100k is irrevelent at this time when NBG is in place. NBG means that if you win the roll on the item in question that you will replace what you are wearing in that slot with the item won. Resist gear does not count as NBG.
If you want to roll on the item based on the PP value of it, that is summed up in the word greed. On a NBG raid, Need has priority over Greed, and only people who Need the item to fill a slot (rather than sell), can roll. If nobody needs the item then the item becomes gravy loot (a term EQ players use to describe greed rolls ie stuff you sell or stick on twinks).
A druid obviously is not going to wear a cloak of flames. A Wizard is obviously not going to wear a cloak of flames. Therefor they don't need the item, reguardless of how much it is worth, and those who do need the item (to use not sell) are the only ones who roll. This is how most raids are done, and if you don't agree with it then don't raid anymore. Druids that roll on CoF IF allowed just usually lose the roll and their reputations along with it because they are just greedy ****'s wanting to ***** over their tanks, and us tanks remember that. Trust me, i think all MA's and SA's keep a list of people they don't like. I know some people on my friends list are anything but.
Same goes for druid epic items such as reavers for example. A Reaver is a 2 handed slashing sword that is usable by Warriors, Paladins, and Shadowknights that drop in City of Mist. Druids and Rangers need the swords as turn in piece for their epic. The result is no warriors, SKs, or pally's roll on reavers because i guess we just have more sense than that...unlike druids that want to roll on a Cloak of Flames.
Edited, Sun Jul 21 16:16:11 2002
i completely agree with you.. IF its my guild.. if its not my guild.. and ive just been invited to the raid.. theres no reason for me not to roll on it.. there is no nbg on a non guild venture.. now 99 percent of the time if its not an item i can roll on .. i dont anyway.. but to say i "shouldnt have the right to" is bs..
taygarr
wiz of the 55th season
the seventh hammer
taygarr
wiz of the 55th season
the seventh hammer
Was this written in English? Or translated from another language?
*shakes head* Simply amazing.....
*Wanders off wondering when Verant is going to find a way to implement an age restricted server.*
*shakes head* Simply amazing.....
*Wanders off wondering when Verant is going to find a way to implement an age restricted server.*
Scholar
19 posts
Don't like the loot? Don't do the raid. Also it is always wise to make sure you know in advance how loot will be distributed. This is a mistake that can be easily avoided.
very true.. if you dont like the way loot is going to be done you shouldnt do it.. that is very true.. naggy is pretty much worthless less your a mellee guy.. so i suppose they should do it with out casters n clerics n buffers right? no.. we would help them so they would go with us to.. makes more then sense..
if im on a raid with my "guild" nbg is always first.. if im on a raid with 30 people i dont know.. well to be honest with you.. 90 % of the time thats open roll on loot anyway..
but normally i jus go one to two grps.. as you lvl into the late fifties you wont need 30 people to go kill something.. and EVERYONE rolls.. if its not a guild raid.. if its just two grps going out and killing something.. EVERYONE will roll.. it has always been that way.. unless someone is just like nah i dont mind go ahead.. which we do depending more on our moods then anything lol..
no one ******* about it.. its just how it is..
you guys want some advice on getting something like the cof.. go for the cocw.. much much easier to get.. lvl up to about 57 on average.. n head out n kill the sea monster is cs.. 10 people average lvl of 57 can do this.. jus buff up good.. hes a wuss.. n drops the CoCW for you mellee guys andddd he drops a 10int item for casters.. not one time has there been ******** when ive gone with some friends and done this..!
i do however also agree like ive said with some of the things the druids saying.. nbg depending on how it is being implemented is a load of crap lol.. if its non guild raid.. i should get to roll
and no im not just a caster i do have high lvl mellee to..
taygarr
wiz of the 55th season
the seventh hammer
if im on a raid with my "guild" nbg is always first.. if im on a raid with 30 people i dont know.. well to be honest with you.. 90 % of the time thats open roll on loot anyway..
but normally i jus go one to two grps.. as you lvl into the late fifties you wont need 30 people to go kill something.. and EVERYONE rolls.. if its not a guild raid.. if its just two grps going out and killing something.. EVERYONE will roll.. it has always been that way.. unless someone is just like nah i dont mind go ahead.. which we do depending more on our moods then anything lol..
no one ******* about it.. its just how it is..
you guys want some advice on getting something like the cof.. go for the cocw.. much much easier to get.. lvl up to about 57 on average.. n head out n kill the sea monster is cs.. 10 people average lvl of 57 can do this.. jus buff up good.. hes a wuss.. n drops the CoCW for you mellee guys andddd he drops a 10int item for casters.. not one time has there been ******** when ive gone with some friends and done this..!
i do however also agree like ive said with some of the things the druids saying.. nbg depending on how it is being implemented is a load of crap lol.. if its non guild raid.. i should get to roll
and no im not just a caster i do have high lvl mellee to..
taygarr
wiz of the 55th season
the seventh hammer
So your wanting to roll on it for your warrior? I played with a guy like that that as stuff was dropping "Oh I cant use it, but my alt can"!. In my opinion if your alt wants it, He she or it needs to be there.
I do agree some NBG is garbage, but for the most part I'm not going to deny someon better equipment just so I can see it and fatten my bank account and try to get a nice item or 2 for myself. Especially when I know that that person will rember my ******** them out of a item they needed. And you can bet that I WILL remember if someone rolls against me for the pure purpose of selling the item.
And remember that if you want to roll on good meele gear, well want to roll on good caster gear, I mean hey why not, I can sell it or trade you for the Cloak you won to sell. :p~
I do agree some NBG is garbage, but for the most part I'm not going to deny someon better equipment just so I can see it and fatten my bank account and try to get a nice item or 2 for myself. Especially when I know that that person will rember my ******** them out of a item they needed. And you can bet that I WILL remember if someone rolls against me for the pure purpose of selling the item.
And remember that if you want to roll on good meele gear, well want to roll on good caster gear, I mean hey why not, I can sell it or trade you for the Cloak you won to sell. :p~
#REDACTED,
Posted: Jul 24 2002 at 5:39 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) well yea.. course.. but read the whole thing man.. not just the last line lol.. if i feel like im going to dik someone out of an item they really need badly..and its a friend or even a friend of a friend.. well hell they can have it.. that not my point.. my point is.. nbg for non guild raids is stupid and you can sit here n talk about how it happens all the time ..but thats not true at all.. in a 12 person raid party or even a 6 person raid party.. every rolls freely 99 percent of the time..and no one really ******* about it except for the whinners that we didnt want there in the first place.. i dont TAKE anything from people.. if its offered to roll on it.. i may or may not do so.. depends on the situation.. in a guild raid.. nbg is always hows its gonna be and thats best for EVERYONE not jus the person that got it.. makes raids smoother for all.. but grping nbg is bs lol.. plain n simple if i feel like twinking my alt.. why is that anyone elses business? so ive lvled up n gotten to where thats possible.. big deal.. should i make banded armor for my paly or warrior n jus use that to lvl 30 when i could just twink him? if u do this your a moron.. and a liar.. anyway lol blah.. be safe all
I did read the entire thing and the impression I got was Greed.
well aparently you cant read very well then can you dumbass..
"99 percent of the time i wouldnt roll anyway"
is that greed you moron?
if someone says go ahead n roll man.. and no one cares.. i roll.. thats all im saying.. people like need to try to be something but a mellee lol.. i have tried pretty much every char out there.. and theres a few classes that get shi% on by people like yourself who call them greedy because when someone says they can have something they might take it.. wtf is that all about? lol that to me.. sounds like whining and greed..
taygarr
wiz of the 55th season
the seventh hammer
"99 percent of the time i wouldnt roll anyway"
is that greed you moron?
if someone says go ahead n roll man.. and no one cares.. i roll.. thats all im saying.. people like need to try to be something but a mellee lol.. i have tried pretty much every char out there.. and theres a few classes that get shi% on by people like yourself who call them greedy because when someone says they can have something they might take it.. wtf is that all about? lol that to me.. sounds like whining and greed..
taygarr
wiz of the 55th season
the seventh hammer
my bad its Feeliux's Cord of Velocity
well it goes to show just how greedy and inconsiderate some casters can be, i also believe the "best" haste iteam to be belt of velocity, tho theres prob some new vex thal drop thats even better.
#REDACTED,
Posted: Jul 19 2002 at 1:32 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) lmao .. mellee always talk about how greedy casters are.. its so stupid .. your no different then the next guy on the server.. so stop with the holier then thou attitude.. geez
Its funny how you guys can portray someone's personality from if they'r a meleer or a caster... quite sad - and people like you say there should be an age restriction?
Blaazze Yodeadhomie
E marr
Blaazze Yodeadhomie
E marr
"some casters"
on website dragon was said to have been a mage lvl 46
i would also like to add i have seen this on a website says it dropped off a dragon in tim deep (not confirmed)
19 posts
Hail all...I've got a QUESTION :)
What's the haste on this?
And what's the min level for a tank on Naggy raid? And Vox raid? Thanks.
What's the haste on this?
And what's the min level for a tank on Naggy raid? And Vox raid? Thanks.
min lvl for naggy raid is meant to be aroun 47 48 haste is 36 %
36 percent I believe, I may, or may not be wrong.
1 post
all my wizards fighting skills are maxxed. sure hope i win the roll on this one. then he could really do some tankin!!
Edited, Wed Jul 3 17:25:35 2002
Edited, Wed Jul 3 17:25:35 2002
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