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Wormhusk Harness  
 

MAGIC ITEM NO TRADE
Slot: WAIST
AC: 20
STR: +15 STA: +15 WIS: +15 INT: +15 HP: +100 MANA: +100 ENDUR: +100
WT: 1.5 Size: TINY
Class: WAR PAL RNG SHD MNK BRD ROG BST BER
Race: ALL
Slot 1, Type 7 (General: Group)
Item Type:Armor
Stackable:No
Lucy Entry By:Mynlaeni
Item Updated By:SwiftyMUSE
Source:Live
IC Last Updated:2020-07-10 07:00:04
Page Updated:Thu Oct 9th, 2008
*This item is the result of a raid event.
Shadows of Luclin Item


Rarity: Common
Level to Attain: 55

[Drops | Comments ]

Drops: This item is found on creatures.



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Uploaded November 27th, 2008
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#REDACTED, Posted: Jul 04 2004 at 8:37 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) So?? take one Harness , add one 36% haste aug from LDoN ( Butcher block ) and throw away that PoS seahorse crap.
RE: Yawn.
# Jul 13 2004 at 11:29 AM Rating: Excellent
*
157 posts
Quote:
So?? take one Harness , add one 36% haste aug from LDoN ( Butcher block ) and throw away that PoS seahorse crap.



haste aug is type 3
this belt is type 7

but since you know the high end game I'm sure you knew this already...
RE: Yawn.
# Aug 19 2004 at 10:40 AM Rating: Default
Well even though the tone of this message and the information is garbage there is a type 7 36% haste aug. Off the named Archer in Ferubi :p
#REDACTED, Posted: Aug 04 2004 at 2:25 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) actully anyone who even talks about mobs with high aoe dmg, and talks about xana and mb, which unless your entire raid is stupid or has 2k hp buffed these mobs aoes are not hard to take, even with mb 4k it doesn't go off unless yoru raid is gimp. and ldon crap isn't high end, lots of people ignore ldons and only know what they have heard, so have fun with dong your ldon while hes in god killing stuff that has 250hp on it
nice belt
# Oct 07 2003 at 8:00 PM Rating: Default
Really nice belt easy to get compare to other mobs in luclin =)
bard item :D
# Jul 29 2003 at 11:21 PM Rating: Decent
/sigh... Been on 3 of these raids, had 5 belts drop total, and didnt get a one :/ my bard would love one. Too bad I can't fault the RL for awarding them to who they did tho, i will admit my guild's warriors and SK's need the additional 200hp a hella lot more than me :D but the 15 int would be hella nice too. As a bard (int caster, believe it or not) at lvl 60 i dont even have 2000 mana despite having almost 3000 hp unbuffed :( and no, kei and the like, even our OWN manasong have no affect on our mana regen.
#KalRox, Posted: Aug 14 2003 at 4:48 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) but then, you only need your mana for 2 songs , so /shrug
RE: bard item :D
# Aug 28 2003 at 5:51 PM Rating: Decent
Two words: Fading Memories
SK equipment
# Jun 03 2003 at 5:34 PM Rating: Default
To hell with all you Paladins. This belt has Shadowknight written all over it Smiley: king

Marder Blacksoul
Grave Lord of DMR
Saryrn

Edited, Tue Jun 3 17:55:45 2003
Chest? noooo
# Nov 06 2002 at 9:25 PM Rating: Default
So I looks at the stats and I sez to myself, I sez, "This breastplate is crap for the mob that drops it!" Then I sez to myself, "Harness? That's a dumb name for a breastplate!" THEN I sez to myself, "Wow, nice belt!"
#REDACTED, Posted: Sep 27 2002 at 9:05 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) totally a pally item, woohoo. for once a nice belt with str ac and wis that clerics dont get auto-looted to them cuz they cant wear it! woohoo clerics go back to playing with yer ghey summoned hammers!
#REDACTED, Posted: Sep 16 2002 at 1:45 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) i was awarded this last night sweet goto love it
nice item
# Sep 15 2002 at 6:00 AM Rating: Default
not really to worried about the str bonus avatar can take care of that..the ac nice for a belt
the wisdom very nice i am sure ill probably never maxx that out..the exta mana lets me cast a few more stuns to stop mobs spells the extra stamina is sweet and hit points ...that adds up alot if you have your alt Exp of natural durabilty maxxed to lvl 3
Just a damn nice belt IMO
Wish I could use this
# Jul 10 2002 at 3:04 PM Rating: Default
ac, str, sta, hp, mana, my dream belt for my cleric. It has wis, but at this level, you shouldnt need more wis or int if you are a caster.
Hadias
# Jul 03 2002 at 3:38 PM Rating: Default
Hey Hadias if you ever look at this message where did you pick up that Shiny trinket of speed?
RE: Hadias
# Jul 18 2002 at 5:38 AM Rating: Default
look at the creator in ssra's look list.
saweet belt
# Jun 17 2002 at 6:32 PM Rating: Good
this is a sweet belt. im a paladin, and i personally look for (2) stats. sta/hps. then resists/ac/wisdom in that order. ive found that 1200 AC with 5k+ HP's raid buffed is much handier than 1400 ac and 200 wisdom with 3k hps. all in what you prefer tho.
Balance
# May 16 2002 at 12:34 AM Rating: Default
Well I think its a good stat balancing item that many can be benifit from :o)

Chantarin 56 Knight of Dragongaurd
The uninformed amaze me
# Apr 18 2002 at 2:03 PM Rating: Default
Most ppl whinning about this being melee/hybrid just dont get it. By the time you are strong enough to get this, you are pretty much already 255wis/int, or you better be by then.

The biggest modifier on this belt is the STA15 and the HP100. After level 60, the rest of the stats are meaningless.

Why do you think Furor wears AC10 legs !?! If you cant figure out why, you dont deserve this belt.

Edited, Thu Apr 18 14:58:36 2002
#REDACTED, Posted: May 09 2002 at 11:05 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) can you please delete all these silly posts,including my own.if it isnt information about the belt or the mob it comes off of,it is spam.
RE: The uninformed amaze me
# Apr 19 2002 at 3:55 PM Rating: Decent
Very good post. For any tank, the 100hp's on here, along with the STA make it quite valuable. For anyone else who can wear it? the stats might matter more... but the HP's and STA still rock.

(funny, I tought I was the only one staring at furors legs... lol... kiddding)
Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 17 2002 at 3:35 PM Rating: Default
Okay, not priest or caster usuable, but has 15 int and wisdom. Add this to the list of items with unbelievable int or wisdom stats that *are* usuable by priest and casters, but have the added HASTE modifiers, hence making them off limits by virtue of that extra stat.

Hey, a_verant_programmer00! Put down the crack pipe and slowly back away.

RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 18 2002 at 10:52 AM Rating: Decent
stop the crying boo hoo..sorry to say but yes some of the other classes do want these stats which are prime requisites..as an sk i definately want that extra int for mana and same for a pally with that wisdom and the ac and str are to boot...BUT i mainly see this as a beastlord item with these stats they would mostly use all the benefits of this and it was primarily made for them most likely since they are a leather only class

Kitkoran Tunereaver 54 bard
Sisu DaPainbringer 54 SK ,Crusader of Greenmist
Kirra Lunerpaw 40 beastlord
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 19 2002 at 11:19 AM Rating: Excellent
I notice a LOT of posts to items people say this item or that is "a CLASS item" and of course the majority follow up with a list of characters they play that fits the CLASS they seem to be trying to direct the item for.

Doing so seems pretty dim witted. Why? Because no item is perfect for a specific character until you take into account what that specific character already has, what role they are filling (not what role a character of that class / race fills generally), and their goals.

For instance, one could say this item fills a niche left vacant by the belt of dwarf slaying, which lacks STA. This belt lacks resistances and a regen effect available on other equipment slot items.

If you are a caster wanting a comparable belt, take the dain belt (which is useable by all). If you are a melee or a hybrid who would prefer STA over resistances and regen effect, pick this belt. Want resistances / aura of battle more than STA? Take the Dain belt.

And this only compares the two items. There are many alternative or "better" belts for different goals, such as the belts dropped in NToV, off Grieg, etc.

Maybe you chose this belt because it is the best one attainable by you, maybe those NToV ones are out of your reach, or maybe because when you evaluated it it would be your choice of belts of all the ones available because it most closely matches your goals.

Edited, Fri Apr 19 12:17:29 2002
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 18 2002 at 3:17 AM Rating: Default
I can understand melee classes wanting more wis/int for tradeskills, really I can. However, it seems most of the items with disgustingly high int/wis stats lately have been melee only items. Most items that are priest/robe caster usable have the wis/int stats a *lot* lower than what melee are getting. (single digits, unless it's pretty rare, or off a toughy mob) And for cripes sake...keep your eyes peeled for a 39+ enchanter, they can increase your wisdom and int (by 44) pretty well. And don't forget to ask for Boon of Garou - 100dex very handy for tailoring - that's my buff plug for the day.

Granted, melee classes start with extremely low wis/int in general, and save their equipment slots for stats that'll directly impact their damaging/efficiency. They don't have 2-10 +wis/int items all over their bodies. But Casters don't get a +3 wis/int item with +10 str, dex, agi, sta items much, compared to about 10 items I've seen, melee only, with 10 or higher wis/int stats. It seems "unbalanced" (sorry, couldn't think of a better word).

No, we won't rely on str to do more damage. We like to carry things around too. We won't use dex to hit more often - we'll use it to help decrease spell interruptions. Agility and Stamina are usefull for *everyone*, casters no less than tanks...AC and HP for when we get hit keeps us alive a few more seconds, perhaps enough time to get off a heal or for the tanks to taunt off of us.

Huh. I guess the point of this is...this annoys me when I'm not seeing any caster type items that swing the other way - very nice str, ac, hp, dex, and/or agi items. I know my chanter would like the first three. As for haste...well, she comes equipt with that in her spellbook.

Vilae
50 Enchanter
Seekers of Darkstone
Bertoxx
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# May 13 2002 at 2:33 PM Rating: Excellent
Honestly...the one thing many of you people don't seem to understand, at the high level of a game is that int is completely irrelivant. What becomes important at the higher end game is items with HIGH MANA. I think casters only have 2 waist slot items available to them that offer 100mana that I know of atm, the belt off dracolich in fear, and the belt of dwarf slaying.

Yes the classes that can use this belt will benefit form it greatly. Casters...shut up about the int, my belt for one doesn't even have int on it, just 75hp/mana(bone clasped girdle) and yet I still have 255 int at 60(boggles). The melee classes that get this item will have that much more mana to cast their various spells that can be very helpfull in the later aspects of the game. One example would be that whenever my guild fight Aaryonar, an SK tanks one of the pets and for them to keep agro they need to spam those spells of theirs, and by god SKs are damn good tanks when need be, good SKs mind you not the pos ebay pansies taht pop up frequently because the whole "dark knight thingy" looks neat. Alos, I for one think a warrior for instance should pass on this belt and let a hybrid that can use the mana have it, while they instead go after some Ntov loot that is more geared towards them, because 100mana belts period are few and far between.

However, a previous poster had a valid point when saying that more info needs to be posted on the item itself. Where does it drop from...maybe some info on the mob that you must obtain it from. How big of a pain in the *** it will be to obtain, and then when we find out it drops form a level 60+ mob/pos RoF event, all of you lowbies that for some reason think paying Verant the little sum they extricate from you monthly means that you know a thing about this game, will perhaps for once go yell your rantings at a wall whom will most likely care a great deal more than anyone on this forum...

Edited, Mon May 13 15:28:10 2002
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 19 2002 at 3:26 PM Rating: Excellent
Look youre line of reasoning is ridiculous, at post 50 many casters have not only maxed int or wis but have many slots dedicated to uppping other stats. Look at many post 50 melees, I doubt if you ask them if they have their needed stats maxed, they will tell you yes. Melees tend not to have the luxury of being able to max out stats unless grouping with a shammy or enchanter pre 57, this is an awesome item as it gives a nice buffer on several stats, im not gonna sound stupid and tag this as a anyones item, it has a nice spread across the melee spectrum and therefore obvioously is gonna be designated by guild or group leader on need. The many times that namless melee has probably taunted whoever off you instead of letting you die or giving you a chance to land another spell you need to be a bit more gracious and shut youre hole, let us have a chance at getting something like this before whining gets it nerfed.

Wuldayen Wy'clin
Pathfinder of Tunare
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 23 2002 at 6:48 AM Rating: Default
i agree with wuldayen casters come to items like this and whine and complain why do melees get all the int/wis items.... shut up. all you casters really have to worry about is whether or not your wis/int is maxed where as a SK/Pal/Rng/Bst needs the str for better chances to hit, they need dex for doublt hits and procs, agil increases AC and ability to dodge and such, plus sta for HPs along with more int/wis so they have mana to heal/buff themselves and debuff/dot/snare/etc. the mobs. when you actually HAVE to worry bout more than one stat an item like this is a god send cause it aids us and thusly yourself(s). so please quit complaining about who can use what. i have personally seen items given to casters that have haste or aura of battle or other stats that casters really dont NEED but you all want them as well... by the way i also am a wizard as well as a SK so i know both worlds. stop your complaining, why dont you make a hybrid alt and see just how long you can last when you go oom cause you have -3 int/wis or something of that nature due to just melee stats. this isnt a perfect world and never will be, get used to it.
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# May 06 2002 at 2:12 PM Rating: Decent
While I agree that not everything with wisdom or int has to be a caster item. I think its lame to say the only stat casters need is wis or int. Like everyone else they benifit from all stats.
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 18 2002 at 5:11 AM Rating: Good
5 posts
I guess more and more melee items with INT and WIS droping is VI's way of saying that melees classes need these stats too. God know how important WIS is to RNGs and PALs (and BSTs) and INT is to SHDs. Now, I know WARs think it's meaningless for them but there are skills that WARs and ROGs use that need INT and WIS and of course +100hps in welcome by anyone, but especially by WARs. So, I just think this item's classes restrictions are very well thought of and attributed. Just my humble opinion :)
____________________________
Ryunzun
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 17 2002 at 5:50 PM Rating: Decent
Just because something has WIS and/or INT does not necessarily make it a "caster" item. Ever hear of trade skills? I'm a bard, and when I'm working on trade skills, I want INT and WIS... as much as possible. Also, INT gives me mana. Alot of you might say that it's pointless, but you're wrong. Very wrong. Flame away... but you're still wrong.

2cp
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 23 2002 at 12:40 AM Rating: Default
If your guild gives you a shot at this because of trade skills, they're idiots. I agree that it isn't just a hybrid belt (very nice melee stats on it), but give me a break with the "warriors can use the intelligence too" crap. Most guilds who acquire stuff like this don't even look at wisdom, intelligence, or mana when handing things out to hybrids.

Edited, Tue Apr 23 01:35:55 2002
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 17 2002 at 9:10 PM Rating: Default
I totally agree. I'm sick of having a 50hp earring drop (pulling stuff out of thin air) and my warrior can't roll for it because it has int, wis, or mana on it. Warriors need hp just like casters need mana...
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 17 2002 at 11:26 PM Rating: Decent
And of course it's hybrid usable, Pallies for instance use Wis for their clerical abilities. +15 Str for extra smacking and +15 Wis for the extra healing comes in handy
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 17 2002 at 4:24 PM Rating: Decent
*
127 posts
RNG, BST, SHD, PAL, BRD... all of these classes get mana, and get additional mana from Int or Wis. Speaking as one of these classes, it is kind of nice to see something that is good bonus mana that I, as a hybrid, would have a chance at rolling on.

If it is +Wis and mana to this degree, an item like this will default to a cleric or other wis caster in any self respecting situation, and I have no problem with that. But all of the hybrid classes listed can really use that mana as well, and its nice that VI is putting in items that can meet that need.

I would say it is not the result of massive crack-use that led to this item, ultimately. Think about it: they could create "an_uber_caster_belt_37" or they could put in a new item that fills a much less populous category. While I don't see as much use for it, I feel the same way about the caster only haste items. Its nice to see a little more variety instead of items that are progressively heavier stacked in Wis/Int "caster stats" or Haste/Str/AC/HP "Melee stats".
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Apr 18 2002 at 8:49 AM Rating: Decent
If you have ever played a Hybrid class you will know that balancing str, sta, dex, AC & HP items with Wisdom/Itel items is very difficult.

Being a Paladin, I have some slots filled with items that have no AC or any other stats other than wisdom simply because it is very difficult to find all the stats we need, so we sacrifice slots. I have had Adamatite Epolets since level 15, Velium Ruby Veil since level 30, Aegis Of Life since level 35 all strictly for Wisdom. Those 3 slots have either no AC or very little AC but have 25 wisdom combined...at level 54 I have 149 Wisdom including 2 from AA. Any Wisdom caster has Wisdom well over 200 by level 50.

There are new suits of Armors coming out for Priest Classes all the time, I read the stats and get excited and then see - Shaman Druid Cleric. I don't get mad since those classes rely on wisdom more than Rangers, Beastlords, and Paladins, but I would also like to see a hybrids get close to 200 wisdom. Our heals help, our buffs help, our spells damage helps.

Putting items like this into the game is helping to balance the wisdom/mana pool that is currently lacking to hybrid classes.

Edited, Thu Apr 18 09:54:22 2002
#REDACTED, Posted: Apr 23 2002 at 12:37 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) You're an idiot if you sacrifice ANY slot for wisdom instead of AC at level 54.
RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Mar 30 2003 at 10:09 PM Rating: Decent
*
155 posts
Unkempt, do yo uhave ANY clue what makes a pally such a good tank? If you just wanted high ac/hp, go for the warrior.. but if i need someone to pull a mob off my **** if I get agro, or want someone I KNOW I will not pull agro from, gimme a pally with the chainstun any day. Or a shadowknight with all their agro-inducing spells. And guess what.. .those spells take mana. Really sucks when the pally goes OOM when the mob is CLOSE to running, the wizzy drops a nuke too soon, and the mob ganks the wizzy because the pally had no mana left to stun...

RE: Who is the designer of this stuff?
# Jun 15 2003 at 4:10 PM Rating: Decent
23 posts
Wisdom is nice for a paladin in particular, arguably more so than for any other hybrid class, because it allows the knight to utilize the various group healing spells (very high mana cost) more frequently, in particular in high-end raid encounters featuring a lot of AE damage (e.g. Aerin Dar, Behemoth, Xanamech, etc.)

That said, however, paladins do not really need vast amounts of Wisdom in XP groups--or even in your average raid battle when you aren't tanking or group-healing frequently. What you really need is mana regeneration. Get yourself an Earring of the Solstice (FT1) which is very commonly available, a pair of Jaylia's Boots of Nobility (FT3) if you can find them, and start investing AA points in Mental Clarity. A paladin standing up--as you'll be doing all the time if you're both tanking and pulling for an XP party--will regenerate 2 mana per tick; even a humble FT1 item will raise that by 50%; get MC3 and FT1--which any 51st level paladin is able to do, irrespective of guild affiliation or server--and you'll effectively have tripled your standing mana regeneration, enough for you to hold aggro against any ranger, rogue, or warrior by simply using Cease and the occasional Stun. You want to cast more spells? You don't really need to; your basic stuns are what you need to be a successful tank; but if you want the luxury of more available mana, get a Clarity, Clarity 2, KEI, etc.

Oh, and as for pulling enemies off casters, you don't need to resort to expensive "chain-stunning." You've lost aggro to a caster? Then cast Force of Akilae or Stun to pacify the enemy while you run up to it, click Taunt and Disarm once in range, then use your 9th level Cease followed by the fastest-casting stun that is ready, and finally, click Taunt again. Repeat as needed.

Even if you fail both Taunt skill checks (contrary to what many people seem to think, Taunt is an all-or-nothing skill: you don't "build up" aggro by using Taunt; you either place yourself at the very top of the hate list or you accomplish nothing whatsoever), three stuns plus the melee damage you are dealing will counter even snare or mesmerization hate.

The bottom line? For anyone, caster, priest, or hybrid, expanding your mana pool beyond a certain minimum (you should be able to cast your most expensive spell at least twice while at full mana) is a luxury which doesn't matter in 95% of all non-raid fights, and on raids, it only matters against major foes--and even then, if you are a knight, it only matters when the enemy is using an AE DD or DoT. So stop worrying so much about your mana pool and instead start working on your mana regeneration, because that is what will enable you to keep going after those people with 255+ Wis/Int have long gone OOM.

Sir Karnos Darkmere
Crusader of the 62nd Circle and 51st Alternate Advancement
Lord of the Order of the Fiery Heart
Firiona Vie
Ummm..
# Apr 17 2002 at 2:59 PM Rating: Default
When im in a group that kills the mob that drops this. As a warrior Ill pass. I would much rather have a Spiked Seahorse Hide Belt. Something about +4 to stats and +1 to resist. And Oh yeah did I mention 34%haste.

Edited, Thu Apr 18 16:23:52 2002
RE: Ummm..
# Jun 19 2002 at 5:59 AM Rating: Default
God, just the HP alone makes this belt better than seahorse belt. Think about it, melees will probly have better haste than the sea horse belt, and very high if not maxed AC, so HP is the way to go, perfect for any MT, or monks for pulling who need vital HP.
#REDACTED, Posted: Apr 17 2002 at 9:56 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) How bad does that suck? Druids need to be able to use this!
#REDACTED, Posted: Apr 16 2002 at 11:10 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Verant has a good sence of humor
Seen this drop...
# Apr 16 2002 at 9:18 PM Rating: Good
*
87 posts
From restless Burrower. Conned red to me at lvl 60.

An easy kill for 16 people raid.

It dropped 4 types of belt and 3 lvl 60 spells for us.

I recommend if you intend on killing the Restless Burrower, make sure it is fully grown, or else you'll get a lousy drop.

Edited, Tue Apr 16 22:14:56 2002
____________________________
"Assiduus usus uni rei deditus et ingenium et artem saepe vincit ..."
- "Constant practice devoted to one subject often outdues both intelligence and skill" -
Ring of Fire
# Apr 16 2002 at 9:15 PM Rating: Default
Wonder if this drops off some of those mobs... hrmmm
ahh
# Apr 16 2002 at 9:11 PM Rating: Default
cleric teaser too
What drops this?
# Apr 16 2002 at 5:00 PM Rating: Default
This belt will do a lot more than just hold up my greaves! Which mob drops this lovely harness? Any information on the level and class would be great. Part of the ring wars, I presume?

Edited, Sun May 5 12:13:55 2002
#REDACTED, Posted: Apr 16 2002 at 5:00 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Why, why can't this be druid usable? =(
RE: doh
# Apr 17 2002 at 11:38 AM Rating: Default
Unless you play on Sullen zek. Then everyone hates druids. Even the Newts.
RE: doh
# Apr 16 2002 at 8:55 PM Rating: Default
*
98 posts
+15 INT and not wearable by casters? Talk about a tease!! :)



(yes this is JK. silly.)

Edited, Mon Jun 28 15:34:04 2004
RE: doh
# Apr 17 2002 at 8:36 AM Rating: Decent
It's wearable by shadow knights, who are intelligence casters. And has wis and is wearable by paladins and rangers. You guys get your own stuff, so enjoy what WE can't wear.
RE: doh
# Apr 17 2002 at 3:55 PM Rating: Default
hear hear 8p


Tremaru
RDK
Torvo
(oh yeah Ranger ;)
RE: doh
# Jun 28 2004 at 2:36 PM Rating: Decent
*
98 posts
My comment was a joke. :P I know very well that bards and SKs have INT! (especially as I used to play both).
#REDACTED, Posted: Apr 16 2002 at 5:41 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) cause no one likes druids
RE: doh
# Apr 16 2002 at 8:40 PM Rating: Decent
Not true... Everybody loves a druid when they need a port ASAP.. :P
#REDACTED, Posted: Apr 16 2002 at 8:07 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) so true
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