Classes: The Shaman
 | Shamen - primitive power. The only magic using class of the barbarians, ogres and trolls, shamen get a variety of spells that combine aspects of most of the other magic using classes. This combination, along with the racial strength, means the class can be played in a variety of different ways.
What is the best way to develop and play your shaman? What spells and skills are the most and least useful? Can a shaman be soloed, and if so how? How should you play your shaman in a group? Post your strategies on how to best play and develop the Shaman and read, rate and comment on what others have to say. |
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is twinking always bad?Follow
18 posts
Here is how I look at it, yes if you know what you are doing...its not as bad, tho you can miss the fun of the game still..I have a level 27 shaman, I started playing EQ about 4 weeks after it came out (I'm an old school EQer)anyways I started this shaman for the most part because a friend of mine just started playing and I thought it would be fun for us both to be around the same level, well I started liking my shaman more and more....and what do you know, now i'm selling in the baz to get him some good stuff....but I did work for my plat, i have NEVER bought plat and will not, I have started sacing. some of my guys ( a level 53 bard a 52 ranger and a 55 rogue ) somone said to me, well that is not working for your plat, but thats where thay are wrong, I worked HARD to get them guys to the level thay where. so I am with you on the work for it deal..tomany people that play now are all about levels and being "a badass" wich I think is dumb, yes it is nice to have good stuff, but it's really more fun not having it
just wanted to tell you he was prob a ebay buyer from the sound s of it
Pity, has this thread died already?
27 posts
imo twinking is kinda a 50/50 call it can be good/bad youll learn the game either way buying plat is for noobs ull find players like lethdar (at level 50 he didnt know what fd was..) anywyas not going to flame any more...
twinking is alaws nice you can kill a bit faster or a bit tuffer mob it does hinder some of your skills like defence too much armor at a low level means the mobs wont hit you till your higher (they do hit you but your defence doesnt raise like it should) so you lose some ac with that and it will take you a while longer and possibly cause you a few extra deaths
i have a pritty twinked toon nuthing crazy like 100k in items but i have a level 4 oger bst with about 25k in gear
guess it really just depends on what your moral standards are
but like i said imo twinking is ok what matters is how you got the $ to do it... me i spent hours and hours farming to get it
twinking is alaws nice you can kill a bit faster or a bit tuffer mob it does hinder some of your skills like defence too much armor at a low level means the mobs wont hit you till your higher (they do hit you but your defence doesnt raise like it should) so you lose some ac with that and it will take you a while longer and possibly cause you a few extra deaths
i have a pritty twinked toon nuthing crazy like 100k in items but i have a level 4 oger bst with about 25k in gear
guess it really just depends on what your moral standards are
but like i said imo twinking is ok what matters is how you got the $ to do it... me i spent hours and hours farming to get it
Here's to The Thread That Wouldn't Die. IMHO twinking is not always bad. As in everything else it depends on how you do it. If you do it through bought plat then I think you are just missing the point of EQ. If you are handing down items from one toon to another then I think it's just simply a matter of one family member helping another. Same holds true for friends who lay great items on you.
No matter how you get your items you are doing yourself and anyone you play with a great disservice if you don't learn how to play your class properly. Having items way beyond your level can, in many instances, impair your ability to learn how to best play your toon.
No matter how you get your items you are doing yourself and anyone you play with a great disservice if you don't learn how to play your class properly. Having items way beyond your level can, in many instances, impair your ability to learn how to best play your toon.
what campdog said ;)
Why not keep the thread going. There are alot of good opinions in this thread. I am against buying plat, it has forever distorted the EQ economy and makes it harder/more expensive to twink my toons! I completely agree with people who say that you need to know how to play your class, some of my early toons got deleted because I didn't raise them right. Not that they were twinked or power leveled, just that I didn't know about keeping every skill possible up. That is how I ended up with a level 40 beastlord who couldn't cast anything but alteration spells, couldn't hit for diddly and crumbled to dust during melee. I have 3 generations of toons due to me leaving the game twice and each time I came back I saved my gear but deleted the previous characters.
So my current example of twinking not being bad is my new warrior. He has good gear for most every slot but most of it is level recommended so it looks better than the stats it gives. At level 26 he has offense, defense, 1HS, dodge, parry, dual wield, double attack and taunt maxxed. Kick, riposte, bash and 2HS are within 30 points of max and will be within a couple levels.
My priority when starting a new alt is a weapon upgrade. The low end game has changed and getting groups can be difficult with less new blood coming in. Most low levels are twinked alts who get PL'd. So I find myself fighting mobs designed to be grouped against all by myself.
Consider this, I start a new shammy and twink up to 200 wis. I have a much larger mana pool than I should for my level and I can take on more mobs before needing to med. BUT when it come to downtime to med, I am sitting far longer to regen that larger mana pool. Am I hurting my character developement? I am still casting spells, the amount of casts per kill will stay the same. Most likely I am hurting my game fun due to the longer med times.
In closing, have fun and know your role.
So my current example of twinking not being bad is my new warrior. He has good gear for most every slot but most of it is level recommended so it looks better than the stats it gives. At level 26 he has offense, defense, 1HS, dodge, parry, dual wield, double attack and taunt maxxed. Kick, riposte, bash and 2HS are within 30 points of max and will be within a couple levels.
My priority when starting a new alt is a weapon upgrade. The low end game has changed and getting groups can be difficult with less new blood coming in. Most low levels are twinked alts who get PL'd. So I find myself fighting mobs designed to be grouped against all by myself.
Consider this, I start a new shammy and twink up to 200 wis. I have a much larger mana pool than I should for my level and I can take on more mobs before needing to med. BUT when it come to downtime to med, I am sitting far longer to regen that larger mana pool. Am I hurting my character developement? I am still casting spells, the amount of casts per kill will stay the same. Most likely I am hurting my game fun due to the longer med times.
In closing, have fun and know your role.
Well, since ya asked ... When I began posting to this thread I was a broke barb with basically one toon. I died far too many times at all levels by teaming with someone who was clueless as to how to play their character. Now, with four toons I enjoy playing ( Barb/Shammy, WE/Druid, Barb/Rogue, Gnome/Necro ) and plat not a problem I can see that twinking is not necessarily a bad thing. Why sell something when it can be of use to another family member? I have also learned to drop a poor player like a bad habit.
So when is twinking bad? IMHO it's bad when the twinks extend the new toon's capabilities far beyond what would be expected for a toon of that level. Considering the items available nowadays to someone with plat to spare it's possible to twink a character to almost permanent PL status. When that happens you have someone who is in a kind of permanent one year old condition. They don't fear being hurt because they don't know they can be hurt. Consider this. There are times when the tank yells ZONE! that I am already running. Other times I stand my ground and slug it out and the group comes out a winner. What's the difference? The difference is that I know my capabilities from countless hours of playing my beloved shammy and making innumerable mistakes. You just don't get that kind of knowlege by PLing to 70 in two days or by having sleeves who's DS takes half a mob's HP in one proc. So twinking is not always bad but it can sometimes be bad.
People play EQ for all kinds of reasons. There are those that must always strive for faster cars, bigger houses and fatter bank acounts. I don't judge those who do. But to my way of thinking they are missing the point of RL, and of EQ as well.
~ Snoww
Edited, Tue Jan 10 07:45:41 2006 by campdog
So when is twinking bad? IMHO it's bad when the twinks extend the new toon's capabilities far beyond what would be expected for a toon of that level. Considering the items available nowadays to someone with plat to spare it's possible to twink a character to almost permanent PL status. When that happens you have someone who is in a kind of permanent one year old condition. They don't fear being hurt because they don't know they can be hurt. Consider this. There are times when the tank yells ZONE! that I am already running. Other times I stand my ground and slug it out and the group comes out a winner. What's the difference? The difference is that I know my capabilities from countless hours of playing my beloved shammy and making innumerable mistakes. You just don't get that kind of knowlege by PLing to 70 in two days or by having sleeves who's DS takes half a mob's HP in one proc. So twinking is not always bad but it can sometimes be bad.
People play EQ for all kinds of reasons. There are those that must always strive for faster cars, bigger houses and fatter bank acounts. I don't judge those who do. But to my way of thinking they are missing the point of RL, and of EQ as well.
Quote:
All of your skills can come in time of need... A rain of poison can be an effective punishment for those that offend you, but only if you have the wisdom to place the rain where it does the most damage to the foe. A blast of the arctic air of my homeland will numb any it strikes, but the cost of calling it from so far away is paid in time.
Shamanhood is a subtle calling, never to be understood by the many... The slow destruction of a foe from the insides, from poison and disease, will never be as flashy as a thunderclap from a great wizard, but the end result is the same: a monster dead.
Shamanhood is a subtle calling, never to be understood by the many... The slow destruction of a foe from the insides, from poison and disease, will never be as flashy as a thunderclap from a great wizard, but the end result is the same: a monster dead.
Edited, Tue Jan 10 07:45:41 2006 by campdog
You know Camp I just wish once I could disagree with you.. even if only if I can lol.. but yet again you make a valid point close to the one I would have made.
I sit sometimes in bazaar and window shop... and I look at the prices people sell stuff for not even uber stuff and I think honestly are people truly that greedy? I mean no kidding some one had a flask of water that we buy at a vendor for a couple of coppers up for a million plat... granted I am sure that one must just be a joke to see if some one will be s tupid enough to buy it or adleast I hope that is the reason... I honeslty hope that person isn't truly hoping to get that plat for that water flask..
I see so much greed in this game that I sometimes think do people realise it is a game? Did you know that Eq plat is the 77th highest currency in the REAL world.. believe it!!! and I find that incredibly sad....
Just as I find it sad when I see an obvious ebay toon play...I think of what he has missed... and what is is missing in his play now....You know in all honest I hate low levels.. I really do.. but with both my shammy and my nec I worked them from birth up to their levels now.. granted my nec has passed my shammy *blush* not cause I don't love my shammy cause I do she will always be my first baby and I will get her up to my nec's level... but even hating low levels the gratification knowing that I worked hard for every one of those levels and every one of their aa's makes me very proud.. and makes me know that when I am in a group I play either one I play them well ... I don't lack confidence cause I know my class.. yes there is still things I am learning but on a whole I know my class damn well.. and that gives me pride that I wouldn't have gotten had I been twinked powerlevelled or bought on ebay...
and now I am rambling.. in essense.. what campdog says I agree with 100%
I sit sometimes in bazaar and window shop... and I look at the prices people sell stuff for not even uber stuff and I think honestly are people truly that greedy? I mean no kidding some one had a flask of water that we buy at a vendor for a couple of coppers up for a million plat... granted I am sure that one must just be a joke to see if some one will be s tupid enough to buy it or adleast I hope that is the reason... I honeslty hope that person isn't truly hoping to get that plat for that water flask..
I see so much greed in this game that I sometimes think do people realise it is a game? Did you know that Eq plat is the 77th highest currency in the REAL world.. believe it!!! and I find that incredibly sad....
Just as I find it sad when I see an obvious ebay toon play...I think of what he has missed... and what is is missing in his play now....You know in all honest I hate low levels.. I really do.. but with both my shammy and my nec I worked them from birth up to their levels now.. granted my nec has passed my shammy *blush* not cause I don't love my shammy cause I do she will always be my first baby and I will get her up to my nec's level... but even hating low levels the gratification knowing that I worked hard for every one of those levels and every one of their aa's makes me very proud.. and makes me know that when I am in a group I play either one I play them well ... I don't lack confidence cause I know my class.. yes there is still things I am learning but on a whole I know my class damn well.. and that gives me pride that I wouldn't have gotten had I been twinked powerlevelled or bought on ebay...
and now I am rambling.. in essense.. what campdog says I agree with 100%
3 posts
Lots of good opinions above spanning quite a bit of time.. its much simpler for me (Guess being an Ogre most of the time). I don't concern myself too much with buying plat (though I wouldn't), twinking isn't as bad to me as buying plat, especially If you got the item yourself -or- earned the cash in-game to buy the item yourself (thats still "earning" it, much like getting a job to buy a car.. you didn't build the car, but you definately earned it).
My only problem with it is what I call "attitude". If you decide to pull 3 or 4 reds, then find out you're gonna die, don't get all upset If I don't jump in and help you out.. cause if you can't kill them, I sure as heck can't. Also try not to get all snotty because I don't want to join you in a romp through something I can't possibly survive wearing my patchwork (remember patchwork, well, maybe some don't but it was considered "woot" when I started). Some of us are not loaded with cash or twinked with items meant for the 50's, so we bash blues... LOTS of them, and besides the drops and exp, they're just as fun.. well for ME anyway. (Of course, any sexy Ogress in trubble I'll help even against reds, but der not many Ogress out der it seems).
If you just GOTTA buy plat and twink up, at least build those skills up though, if for no reason than the embarrasment you might get in a group if somebody notices that Mr. High and Mighty is only hitting for 2 with a 50/1 weapon (yes, I KNOW there isn't one...)
My only problem with it is what I call "attitude". If you decide to pull 3 or 4 reds, then find out you're gonna die, don't get all upset If I don't jump in and help you out.. cause if you can't kill them, I sure as heck can't. Also try not to get all snotty because I don't want to join you in a romp through something I can't possibly survive wearing my patchwork (remember patchwork, well, maybe some don't but it was considered "woot" when I started). Some of us are not loaded with cash or twinked with items meant for the 50's, so we bash blues... LOTS of them, and besides the drops and exp, they're just as fun.. well for ME anyway. (Of course, any sexy Ogress in trubble I'll help even against reds, but der not many Ogress out der it seems).
If you just GOTTA buy plat and twink up, at least build those skills up though, if for no reason than the embarrasment you might get in a group if somebody notices that Mr. High and Mighty is only hitting for 2 with a 50/1 weapon (yes, I KNOW there isn't one...)
campdog wrote:
I have also learned to drop a poor player like a bad habit.
So when is twinking bad? IMHO it's bad when the twinks extend the new toon's capabilities far beyond what would be expected for a toon of that level.
So when is twinking bad? IMHO it's bad when the twinks extend the new toon's capabilities far beyond what would be expected for a toon of that level.
Love ya Campie and I think we really agree, but I'm gonna have to pick on yer wording here a bit - I think you should have used 'player' in both cases (benefit of the doubt point - I'm assuming your definition of 'poor player' = not only playing poorly but not responding well to coaching - )
('Smith Barney voice')We get our extended capabilities the the old fashioned way .. we eaaarn them('normal voice)
Extending your toon's abilities beyond their level, but within the player's skillset is an admirable goal imo. Whether you're talking about a ranger(/monk/other roadkill) with the gear/AAs to tank above their level or (more to the point) a shammie getting the Pet Hold AA so they can pull (not recommended for 'cutting-edge content' but it blows peoples mind even on easy stuff where you don't really need single pulls), stretching your capabilities is a great next step once you've learned the basics (regardless, someone that doesn't know/won't learn those IS a liability)
- the 'best pulling shaman on Stromm' ;-)
Quote:
a shammie getting the Pet Hold AA so they can pull (not recommended for 'cutting-edge content' but it blows peoples mind even on easy stuff where you don't really need single pulls).
Hey now, Brew... let's not under-estimate pet pulling. Running through Stoneroot Falls the other day on route to a mission instance, I noticed a Drachnid (level 70) wielding a Skymaul surrounded by 2 other drachnids and a few roamers.
I pointed it out and Necro01 says, "Too many adds. It'll take too long to clear to it." I said, "1K says I can single it!" Ranger01 says, "You're on." Pally01 says, "You pull and you're tanking it," and keeps running to instance. I load our level 55 peet. Wunshi, SoW and Spiritual Serrenity later I send the pet in then back off with /pet hold. He comes single and 2 minutes later after a quick root/rot, I'm looting Skymaul and 1k richer.
Now, a lucky round of hits or the pet getting hung up in the geometry and bye-bye pet... hello adds and Mojo is heading to his bind naked. But with a full spell book and a couple key AA's, any shammy can make that pull most of time. :)
Hehe, I love being a shammy !!
Yell at me if ya like for pounding on a deceased equine. I was surfing the EQ forums and came up with this link. Interesting, no? Plat buyers do go to hell but they get to go in a Cadillac.
2cp
Twinking is neither bad nor good. Twinking a character that your starting to play is just an extension on past regrets that you got from your past characters. Reason why most folks twink their characters is to make em feel good that they come back to an old Orc with a Blackened Acrylia sword that can kill him in 2 hits and not running back to the nearby guards for help. But as time goes on twinking will matter most. Because this will determine if you learn something. If the twink progress too fast and didnt even learned the skills and abilities of his character its just plainly wasting his earned gear (either through buying or from high end friends). My honest opinion I prefer twinking because of the current state of players and game contents. I just have to learn ahead of time what I need to learn to make my character worth playing. And have fun playing it.
Twinking is neither bad nor good. Twinking a character that your starting to play is just an extension on past regrets that you got from your past characters. Reason why most folks twink their characters is to make em feel good that they come back to an old Orc with a Blackened Acrylia sword that can kill him in 2 hits and not running back to the nearby guards for help. But as time goes on twinking will matter most. Because this will determine if you learn something. If the twink progress too fast and didnt even learned the skills and abilities of his character its just plainly wasting his earned gear (either through buying or from high end friends). My honest opinion I prefer twinking because of the current state of players and game contents. I just have to learn ahead of time what I need to learn to make my character worth playing. And have fun playing it.
Quote:
I was surfing the EQ forums and came up with this link.
Plat sellers have created the very need for new players (wiht no connections)to buy plat. Ironic, isn't it?
From the article:
Quote:
SOE is aware of an issue, but seems unable to find out what it is and put a stop to it.
Pffffffffffffft. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that if plat selling were hurting SoE and not helping it, it would have been crushed from the beggining. I imagine the only thing SoE regrets is that they haven't been able to tap into the profits. YET.
1 post
i think that twinkin is bad because it has a downside you really don't have as much fun and you have a sense of fealing that you did not really build up your toon like everyone else!
But that is just me! lol please reply if posible
But that is just me! lol please reply if posible
Nothing wrong with twinking, and it doesn't make the game any less fun, assuming you've already played through that portion at least once.
I levelled my first character with no twinking, as I would never buy plat in a game for RL cash.
But now, I have plenty of plat, and nearly no use for it on my main, except for moving augments.
So, what's a guy to do? Twink :)
Of course my top twinks now are raid-rot twinked, more than bazaar twinked, but I have a few in the stable that are bazaar geared.
I levelled my first character with no twinking, as I would never buy plat in a game for RL cash.
But now, I have plenty of plat, and nearly no use for it on my main, except for moving augments.
So, what's a guy to do? Twink :)
Of course my top twinks now are raid-rot twinked, more than bazaar twinked, but I have a few in the stable that are bazaar geared.
It's true. Funny how time alters yer perceptions. The two toons I play the most are me beloved shammy and a druid. Both have as much gear as ya can expect to get out of the bazaar. It's rare that either one returns to POK without 800 to 1K plat either in vendor trash or trader items. Since I won't be able to upgrade them much further without raiding the plat basically just sits unless I throw a couple K into tradeskills. That doesn't happen much since I don't have much fun clicking my mouse endlessly.
I remember going to Blackburrow and being awed that a HL player was letting stuff rot that was worth 2 or 3 plat per item! Now I think nothing of throwing 2K into a new toon just to see if I like the class.
On the other hand I just recently got murdered in DS when I partnered with a 54 monk who was hitting for 25 - 35. Just as the light was dawning he trained us and died along with me because he didn't FD. So twinking isn't always bad but it can be bad. :-)
25 posts
wow Camp i liked that link alot. I am against buying plat in any form and as a poor Old school player i spend alot of time in the less pop zones where plat and drops are harder to come by. and i can't afford most of the stuff in the Baz anymore. lol logged on my 35 necro the other day and he was wearing Gloomingdeep pants :P. When i make a new toon i pretty much invest all the plat i have. Witch in most cases is less than 5K. and i get the job done just fine. I have a wurmslayer i spent 20k back in e'ci and i will prob never use it again the new items being so much better. but I can't sell it for 1 or 2 k. it took me 2 months back in the day and a ton of help ... TY all my Old Friends from -RECON- and -CLAN DIRE WOLF-. I had a 65 warr that was top notch before the merge had a ton of the really hard( back than) stuff to get. Than i had to take a few years off because I had a Daughter and with the merge and eq2 most of my Guild had left. so i gave my acct to my RL bro and fig'd my eq days had come and gone :). per Last june 15th well i guess the one before last as it is the end of june :). when my bro gave me a new acct with all the Exps. i had just had my 2nd child a boy :) ty :) and had a lot of free time on my hands when i was home with him. so I started back up. course 1 st thing i did was head to the Baz to find a good deal and start a new Chr. I had dec to go with a Bst but wow was i shocked to see the prices :( all the old school stuff was way out classed by the new stuff and the price chg from what i remembered from e'ci was HUGE. But being the die hard EQer i am i took it and made the best. I called in some Old Favors and barrowed some plzt ( it has all been repaid :) but still i don't think what i started with could IMHO be compared to a twink was about 3k worth of gear. And got back to biz I now have all the Toons you will see listed below. not 1 of them started with more than 4k worth of gear. I like to think that i know how to play most of my toons the"Right" way and have never been tossed out of any group. but like Camps link said i can't afford to buy anything in the baz 3 months ago my bro paid 90k for a skymaul.. now 250k on tunare. I can't afford to twink my toons :P anyway sorry for the ramble but Camp i really did like that post :) ( did i say that yet? )
it's... dying... again...
Have any of you tried the new servers combine and sleepers? Takes even me back in time... impossible to twink..and you work very hard for every little level you want lol... been playing on it granted in spare time from my duties on normal server, but has taken me like a month to get to level 12 hahaha so much running about to do... no pok :(.. it is great fun though for those who like the old eq ...and tradeskills are actually a good thing to have on these servers...
Playing a lv21 iksar necromancer on Sleeper... I like the idea of the servers, but too many of the games newer elements have been introduced to make the game easier. Hell, they even added some new (overpowered) items JUST for the progression servers. And, while there are some decent people on there, I've found a majority of the people on there to be arrogant, stuck up perfectionists.
Sadly the more I play on the combine the more irritated I am getting.. it is fun don't get me wrong for what it stands for.. however the PEOPLE are way puting me off... camp stealing, kill stealing running amok on there... now that I get out more as I am leveling I am seeing it more... since I am not just playing close to home... it is rather disgusting I have to tell ya... you are right argogant though is too good a word for some... there are a few nice peeps but on a whole...I think I stick with my own server more...combine will just be used as a place to excape to for a few hours on my own.
hi i have a lvl 61 shammy i have played eq sence 1999 and i can tell you that there are toons out there 3 and 4 months old that are in thair 70s :( i know its sad that i took the time to auctually play my toon do the quest work hard... i started out making patchwork armor had same handmade armor till i saved enuf plat to buy better or make better some times i got handme downs, my point it i love my Shammy, you tend to bond with your toon when he is in peril,
and boy was i ever lol, sure you can get a couple Ubber pals a cleric and a druid to pl you and you can Buy plat on line but if you tweak, can you realy play your toon? if your on a Cr and get jumped How is your Hand to Hand? less than a 100? well your be after 2 corpses then. please dont take the easy way out, it'll make the game come to life for you if you work at it, remember you'll only be broke till lvl 48 or so the Ice Giants drop good loot and plat.
and boy was i ever lol, sure you can get a couple Ubber pals a cleric and a druid to pl you and you can Buy plat on line but if you tweak, can you realy play your toon? if your on a Cr and get jumped How is your Hand to Hand? less than a 100? well your be after 2 corpses then. please dont take the easy way out, it'll make the game come to life for you if you work at it, remember you'll only be broke till lvl 48 or so the Ice Giants drop good loot and plat.
very well said Draxxu :)
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