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#27 Dec 16 2013 at 11:21 PM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Hey Ugly.

Are the internet stories of Chantix true? Some of the side effects sound kind of disturbing.


I can't speak for anyone else's possible experience, but from my own, I wouldn't give Chantix to my worst enemy. For me the first "alteration" wasn't that bad. Dreams became real. Not as in "Wow, that dream seemed so real." , but as in, as far as my mind could ascertain, they were real. Awake or asleep, there was no difference.

Then it got worse. The dreams started to go back to feeling like dreams, but that feeling transferred to reality. I literally couldn't tell if I was awake or asleep. It may not sound that bad, but my mind started freaking out wondering " Am I awake? Am I asleep? Is this real? Am I even who or what I think I am?" I found it terrifying.

It was kinda like that movie Inception, and perhaps if I had seen that movie before taking it, I would've had some frame of reference. Then again, maybe not. I quit taking it and just quit smoking without it. I will say the Chantix probably did help because I didn't smoke while I was taking it, so by the time I quit smoking I was already over the nicotine withdrawals and such.

I'm no Doctor, but I'd advise to err on the side of caution. At the first sign of anything odd, I'd bail on it before things got any worse.
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#28 Dec 16 2013 at 11:41 PM Rating: Good
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Weird when I was on Chantix all I had was a little nausea, but it didn't help me quit.

I quit cold turkey on June 1st, and other then not having as bad of asthma I feel no different. Nothing tastes better, I dont feel better, if anything I always feel more anxious. I can smell smokers now but it still doesn't smell bad unless its the stale 15 mins later smell, but if they light one up right next to me it smells good to me.

The only thing stopping me from smoking again is cost, school is all I can afford atm.

Edited, Dec 16th 2013 11:42pm by BeanX
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#29 Dec 16 2013 at 11:51 PM Rating: Good
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#30 Dec 17 2013 at 1:40 AM Rating: Good
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BeanX wrote:
Weird when I was on Chantix all I had was a little nausea, but it didn't help me quit.

I quit cold turkey on June 1st, and other then not having as bad of asthma I feel no different. Nothing tastes better, I dont feel better, if anything I always feel more anxious. I can smell smokers now but it still doesn't smell bad unless its the stale 15 mins later smell, but if they light one up right next to me it smells good to me.

The only thing stopping me from smoking again is cost, school is all I can afford atm.

Edited, Dec 16th 2013 11:42pm by BeanX


I haven't smoked in 4 years and it's still that way. I'm not more anxious, but my sense of smell and taste didn't change, other than stale smoke is unbearable. Sadly, when I'm around smokers, the "fresh" smoke still smells great to me. Even worse, from time to time, such as after a cup of coffee or if I smell cheesecake, I will crave a smoke...badly.
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#31 Dec 17 2013 at 5:11 AM Rating: Good
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Stalker rdmcandie wrote:
Hey Ugly.

Are the internet stories of Chantix true? Some of the side effects sound kind of disturbing.
Never read them so no idea. I've only suffered from nausea. My wife can't use it though as it made her crazy. Even after she stopped taking it she was crazy (her words) for a few months. One of those things that's different for each person I assume. I found Zyban far worse for side effects.
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#32 Dec 17 2013 at 5:47 AM Rating: Good
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I will crave a smoke...badly.

Don't worry, it seems like the craving will never end, but they do when you die.

Quit probably 6 months ago, quit nicotine replacement (that actual hard part for me) a few months ago. Had an exciting time almost suffocating when I was sick a few weeks ago, no one really seems sure why, doc was like "hmm asthma?" and that treatment plan has worked fine. Won't be relapsing though, what with the increased risk of sudden death via respiratory failure. Probably the only way I'd have stayed quit, so I'd recommend that to everyone: have a serious respiratory complication no one seems sure about...or, you know, willpower.

While almost certainly better than cigarettes, because idling burning yourself with them is probably healthier than inhaling them, I would be a little concerned about the long term use of "e-cigarettes". Not much data about their use yet, and several logical concerns about the mechanism possibly causing chronic conditions, not regulated by FDA, etc. Basically as safe as bath salts. That should be their marketing slogan really...."safe as bath salts, but you won't become a zombie....probably."
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#33 Dec 17 2013 at 7:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Smasharoo wrote:
I will crave a smoke...badly.

Don't worry, it seems like the craving will never end, but they do when you die.
Another good reason to look forward to that then.
#34 Dec 17 2013 at 7:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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Sadly, when I'm around smokers, the "fresh" smoke still smells great to me.


As a life long non-smoker, that smells good to me as well. So maybe it's just a pleasant aroma, and not an undeniable craving.
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#35 Dec 17 2013 at 7:52 AM Rating: Good
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Wouldn't call it pleasant, but at the same time wouldn't really call it bad either. Might be one of those things that I've just been desensitized to.
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#36 Dec 17 2013 at 8:19 AM Rating: Good
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As a life long non-smoker, that smells good to me as well. So maybe it's just a pleasant aroma, and not an undeniable craving.

"Smells good" was an incomplete description. "Smells good enough to shiv those ******** who haven't quit yet and take their cigarettes and smoke all of them stubbing each one out on their broken destroyed corpses" would be more accurate. Or maybe that's just me. To be fair, I feel that way about people carrying lilacs as well.
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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#37 Dec 17 2013 at 8:39 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
DSD wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
You started smoking when you were six?
You think I had Xavier when I was fourteen?

You seem like that kind of girl Smiley: grin


I was a good girl in (most of) high school. Still pure as the driven snow at fourteen Smiley: nod

Smasharoo wrote:
As a life long non-smoker, that smells good to me as well. So maybe it's just a pleasant aroma, and not an undeniable craving.

"Smells good" was an incomplete description. "Smells good enough to shiv those @#%^s who haven't quit yet and take their cigarettes and smoke all of them stubbing each one out on their broken destroyed corpses" would be more accurate. Or maybe that's just me. To be fair, I feel that way about people carrying lilacs as well.


This. Including the lilac bit. I'd kill for Lilacs.

I've been reading up on e-cigs, and while they may be as safe as bath salts, the way I figure it is this. I know that not only do I have a nicotine addiction, but an oral and hand fixation. I know that e-cigs have been the only thing in twenty years that have made me not want to shiv some tucker when I quit smoking. I know that weaning off nice will take time, but I'd rather do it slow and right, than fast and fall off the band wagon (again). And I figure e-cigs are safer in the long run, then inhaling 400 potential types of poison. I'm ok if they aren't perfect for now. They're a hell of a lot better than what I was previously doing
#38 Dec 17 2013 at 9:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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I know that not only do I have a nicotine addiction, but an oral and hand fixation

I'm going to walk away quietly whistling now.
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Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#39 Dec 17 2013 at 9:48 AM Rating: Good
Haha, I don't have any kind of chemical addiction. Let me gloat about that in the most obnoxious way possible.

Oh wait, I already did.
#40 Dec 17 2013 at 9:51 AM Rating: Good
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DSD wrote:
And I figure e-cigs are safer in the long run, then inhaling 400 potential types of poison.
Trenton, New Jersey?
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#41 Dec 17 2013 at 1:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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DSD wrote:
I've been reading up on e-cigs, and while they may be as safe as bath salts, the way I figure it is this. I know that not only do I have a nicotine addiction, but an oral and hand fixation. I know that e-cigs have been the only thing in twenty years that have made me not want to shiv some tucker when I quit smoking. I know that weaning off nice will take time, but I'd rather do it slow and right, than fast and fall off the band wagon (again). And I figure e-cigs are safer in the long run, then inhaling 400 potential types of poison. I'm ok if they aren't perfect for now. They're a hell of a lot better than what I was previously doing

Right on. I too suffer from twitchy hands and with the amount of driving I do it gets pretty bad. If I'm not twirling my e-cig I'd be typing on my phone. Tobacco free for four years; nic free for two. I'm actually mixing up a few small batches of Clove and RY4 right now.

My sweet spot gear wise is eGo batteries with Boge 2 Ohm cartomizers (with drip tips). My friend, who's been on the e-sticks for seven years and working on his own juice business, keeps trying to turn me on to the giant lightsaber-like battery and tank systems. I think he's just overcompensating...
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#42 Dec 17 2013 at 1:59 PM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:
I know that not only do I have a nicotine addiction, but an oral and hand fixation

I'm going to walk away quietly whistling now.

Well... that's no fun. Why be a gentleman now? Smiley: sly
#43 Dec 17 2013 at 3:26 PM Rating: Good
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I used Champix (precursor to Chantix). Muddled my brain for a while at first and when the dose ramped up (at 2 weeks?) couldn't think clearly, couldn't sleep, felt horrible.

Smoking became very very frustrating, you stop getting that relief feeling but you still want it. Like ************ without the payoff. It becomes pointless work so you just kind of stop doing it because why bother. Once the payoff goes away smoking really does become kind of nasty, you don't have the good feeling overriding the nasty stuff it does to you, it starts to taste gross (it always did your mind just told you it didn't because it wanted the nicotine.) It worked for me. Hardest part after the grogginess wore off was break times at work, I had to force myself to go outside and suck in some fresh air or something because I wasn't taking my smoke breaks and it was ******** up my internal clock.

What kept me off of it after I went off the champix was exercise. I found after my lungs cleared out with the horrible chest cold like symptoms you get when the little hairs in your lungs grow back I could breath much better and an exercise routine helped me get through the cravings because I didn't want to suffocate during my warm up on the treadmill that day.

Champix is AWFUL, and worth every second of agony. It's not supposed to feel good, it's supposed to stop you from smoking, and it works, like Buckley's.
#44 Dec 17 2013 at 11:00 PM Rating: Good
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Good on ya. I know it was difficult for me, I had mixed success. Finally I just had enough, particularly of the waking up feeling like I had been trying to breath through a mouth full of dirty socks all night.

I didn't do any of the gum, patches, etc. Just chewed lots of gum and sunflower seeds to transition. That, and when all the restaurants and bars banned smoking inside, that helped as well.
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#45 Dec 18 2013 at 3:39 AM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:
I will crave a smoke...badly.

Don't worry, it seems like the craving will never end, but they do when you die.

Quit probably 6 months ago, quit nicotine replacement (that actual hard part for me) a few months ago. Had an exciting time almost suffocating when I was sick a few weeks ago, no one really seems sure why, doc was like "hmm asthma?" and that treatment plan has worked fine. Won't be relapsing though, what with the increased risk of sudden death via respiratory failure. Probably the only way I'd have stayed quit, so I'd recommend that to everyone: have a serious respiratory complication no one seems sure about...or, you know, willpower.

While almost certainly better than cigarettes, because idling burning yourself with them is probably healthier than inhaling them, I would be a little concerned about the long term use of "e-cigarettes". Not much data about their use yet, and several logical concerns about the mechanism possibly causing chronic conditions, not regulated by FDA, etc. Basically as safe as bath salts. That should be their marketing slogan really...."safe as bath salts, but you won't become a zombie....probably."


Based purely on the design, they should be safer than cigs, you still get whatever toxins are in vaporized tobbaco, but you don't get the debris from a partial burning.

Air quality of LA instead of Linfen.
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#46 Dec 18 2013 at 4:39 AM Rating: Excellent
Timelordwho wrote:
Based purely on the design, they should be safer than cigs, you still get whatever toxins are in vaporized tobbaco, but you don't get the debris from a partial burning.


There is no tobacco in an e-cig, unless it's natural extract is used as flavoring. And there is zero combustion, and thus, none of the carcinogenic compounds generated during combustion . What's in an e-cig?

- Glycerol (USP grade only, either synthetic or natural, neither of which contain the toxic diethylene glycol commonly used in media scare tactics)
- Raw nicotine
- Natural and artificial flavors (the very same used in food and drink)

With the exception of the nicotine (which is optional), all of these ingredients are GRAS (generally recognized as safe) by the FDA. You almost certainly consume them daily whether you realize it or not (contained in many oral medications, artificial flavorings, and pretty much any food compound that is not water soluble, not to mention lotions, creams, and other topical applications).

E-cigarettes work by vaporizing this mix using a heated wire coil, much the same way a drop of water sizzles and evaporates on a hot pan. The only legitimate health concern is the long term effect of absorption of these compounds through the lungs, rather than through oral consumption or injection, which is far more common than most people think.

http://publichealth.drexel.edu/~/media/files/publichealth/ms08.pdf wrote:
By the standards of occupational hygiene, current data do not indicate that exposures to vapers from contaminants in
electronic cigarettes warrant a concern. There are no known toxicological synergies among compounds in the aerosol,
and mixture of the contaminants does not pose a risk to health.


Edited, Dec 18th 2013 4:42am by BrownDuck
#47 Dec 18 2013 at 7:53 AM Rating: Good
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"Generally recognized as safe" is a stupid phrase, like "non-lethal" levels. Baseball bats are generally recognized as safe toys and non-lethal until someone swings for your face. This really has nothing to do with the conversation.
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#48 Dec 18 2013 at 1:46 PM Rating: Decent
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With the exception of the nicotine (which is optional), all of these ingredients are GRAS (generally recognized as safe) by the FDA. You almost certainly consume them daily whether you realize it or not (contained in many oral medications, artificial flavorings, and pretty much any food compound that is not water soluble, not to mention lotions, creams, and other topical applications).

E-cigarettes work by vaporizing this mix using a heated wire coil, much the same way a drop of water sizzles and evaporates on a hot pan. The only legitimate health concern is the long term effect of absorption of these compounds through the lungs, rather than through oral consumption or injection, which is far more common than most people think.


Oh the only concern is the completely novel and unstudied delivery mechanism that's been shown to be harmful in essentially every other instance it's been used in? Well, if it's ONLY that. You mean the body of the e-cigs aren't made of white phosphorus? Well, **** it then, perfectly safe, clearly. It's a great boon for humanity that you don't work in any sort of field that requires judgement.

It's ok to say "no data, but simmilar things are harmful." It's not ok to say "no data, but reductionism tells me the all hydrocarbons can be made into sugar and that's fine!"

See the difference? When there *IS* data, we'll have a better idea of health effects. When there *isn't* data, the default position shouldn't be "probably perfectly safe" unless there's a large amount of data from a cohort utilizing something extremely similar. Not the case here. While there are exceptions, generally the act of vaporizing and inhaling things other than water isn't particularly good for you.

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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#49 Dec 19 2013 at 8:37 PM Rating: Decent
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Smasharoo wrote:
Oh the only concern is the completely novel and unstudied delivery mechanism that's been shown to be harmful in essentially every other instance it's been used in?


Except for, say medical vaporizers, used in hospitals and on an outpatient basis all the time (and FDA approved for those purposes). Which, scary rhetoric aside is exactly what an e-cig does.

Every single thing in an e-cig is FDA approved. What an e-cig does meets FDA approval. The problem is that it falls through a bit of a definition crack because of the synthetic nicotine. The FDA allows nicotine in products more or less grandfathered in as "harmful as hell, but we can't make them illegal" (ie: tobacco products), or in "smoking cessation" devices (which have to undergo a whole different FDA process). Since e-cigs don't meet the latter definition, they fall into the former from an FDA perspective.

Add in some early reports of contaminants in e-cigs (based either on erroneous reports, or very early brands from China), a bit of linguistic manipulation (propyl glycol vs diethyl glycol), and shrieks about "they contain antifreeze!" and you've got the makings of easy hysteria. And I suppose the odd collusion of both the tobacco industry *and* the anti-smoking folks doesn't help either (try to figure that one out!).


Having said that, you're possibly correct about the whole "vaporizing and inhaling stuff" bit. But honestly, if the alternative is smoking cigarettes, it's a choice that is 100,000 times better. You're correct that we don't have complete data. But we do have pretty complete data about cigarettes. They kill millions of people a year. Even if e-cigs only kill at half the rate, it would represent the biggest reduction in smoking related fatalities in the history of us caring about smoking related fatalities (and I think we can all agree that the long term health risks are likely far far far less severe than that).


Fighting against e-cigs is like fighting against airbags in cars because even though they'll reduce the number of fatalities in head on collisions by a factor of 10, they can't make driving 100% safe. Sorry, but that's just a silly argument. Fighting against something that will absolutely save millions of lives because you're holding out for your magical unicorn stuffed world where no one smokes anymore is pretty darn silly and selfish IMO (that's not directed at you, but at the idiot anti-smokers who have switched their ire at e-cigs for some bizarre reason).

This is monumentally stupid btw
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#50 Dec 19 2013 at 9:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Except for, say medical vaporizers, used in hospitals and on an outpatient basis all the time (and FDA approved for those purposes). Which, scary rhetoric aside is exactly what an e-cig does.

Yeah, no. There's no such thing as a "medical vaporizer" approved by the FDA. Do you mean a nebulizer, which is a completely different delivery mechanism? Or do you just have no fucking clue what you're talking about?

Just kidding, it's that last one.
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Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#51 Dec 20 2013 at 12:27 AM Rating: Good
Smasharoo wrote:
Or do you just have no fucking clue what you're talking about?
That would be you, this time around, champ. A nebulizer does exactly the same thing as an ecigarette - convert a liquid to an aerosol for the purpose of inhalation. Also, guess what compound is used in nebulizers when the desired medication is not water soluble? Yep, propylene glycol. The exact same one used in e-cigarettes.

Look, I know you have an overwhelming desire to appear to know everything about everything here, but it's just not always the case, especially this time. Deal with it, move on, quit dwelling on it.

Edited, Dec 20th 2013 12:29am by BrownDuck
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