Hey.
I think you're missing one very simple (and fairly obvious) point. If these rings cost 200PP to make and can be sold at 1000PP, someone else will make them and undercut you.
This doesn't necessarily mean there's anything wrong with the price you're charging. Personally, I wouldn't pay 1KPP for the ring. But, that's a personal preference. (I'd buy the bits myself and find someone to imbue the gem for me. After this, I could find a jeweller to put it together for a very small fee.)
The rarity and difficulty to obtain for any item in the game does effect it's price. This is a given. There's not even room for debate on this one. And, these rings are neither rare, nor hard to obtain. (The hardest bit is getting the gem imbued.)
You've obviously taken the time and effort to build your jewellery skill up. And, it is only right that you are allowed to profit from this. However, both you and the buyer have to accept the price. If you're both happy, that's not an issue. If they decide you're ripping them off, you get no coins.
Either way, loosen up a bit! *Grin* If they're selling at 1KPP, you're makin' a fortune and can afford to ignore your critics.
The truth is remarkably malleable. It can be shaped to fit any man's beliefs. The value of this ring is similar. To you, it's with more than 2KPP. To many others, it's not. No big deal! *Shrug*
AlAaraaf.
Imbued Platinum Fire Ring
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[Comments ]
Crafted: This item is crafted by players. 
Expansion:  Yield: 1 x Imbued Platinum Fire Ring Progression server item. |
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 Uploaded November 27th, 2008 |
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"Te aurdire no possum. Musa sapienum fixa est in aura."
Scholar
16 posts
God I must be bored to respond...
1) I didn't miss the point that I'd be undercut. I get undersold on these things all the time. That was not the reason for my rant. I was confused because people tell me the rings are worth less due to their cheap production cost. I don't see how that makes a difference.
2) Obviously if the buyer doesn't agree to the price I get no coins. I have yet to find a way to demand money from other players in EQ.
3) You're right, the rarity and difficulty of obtaining an item affects its price. My question is why. If a rusty dagger drops in NToV, is it worth more than one that drops off a skelly in Nek? I will never understand how prices are set in EQ. The economy makes no sense. It's like people on EBay buying brad pit's soiled underwear for 2 grand. "Oooh it came from the Dragon Necropolis so it's worth 60k" sounds just as stupid to me as "Oooh they touched brad pit so they're worth 2 thousand dollars". I guess to some people having smelly hanes from brad is worth more money than having the boxers I'm wearing right now, but that's no system to build an economy on.
And these rings aren't hard to obtain, eh? Try getting down to the depths of Sol B and buying the imbue fire opal spell off Zordak.
I know I'm not going to change anything, but I like to try.
Olurin Spelweaver
Virtute et Armis
7th Hammer.
Oh and by the way....
"The truth is remarkably malleable. It can be shaped to fit any man's beliefs."
That's the most illogical, immoral and down right awful thing I've ever read. I'm not going to get into philosophy on a chat board for a video game, but Jeebus. Try taking a math class some time and see if you can make 2+2=5 by believing it.
Well, I'm off to change the truth to fit my belief that I'm a rock star. See you guys on tour.
Edited, Tue May 14 07:16:54 2002
1) I didn't miss the point that I'd be undercut. I get undersold on these things all the time. That was not the reason for my rant. I was confused because people tell me the rings are worth less due to their cheap production cost. I don't see how that makes a difference.
2) Obviously if the buyer doesn't agree to the price I get no coins. I have yet to find a way to demand money from other players in EQ.
3) You're right, the rarity and difficulty of obtaining an item affects its price. My question is why. If a rusty dagger drops in NToV, is it worth more than one that drops off a skelly in Nek? I will never understand how prices are set in EQ. The economy makes no sense. It's like people on EBay buying brad pit's soiled underwear for 2 grand. "Oooh it came from the Dragon Necropolis so it's worth 60k" sounds just as stupid to me as "Oooh they touched brad pit so they're worth 2 thousand dollars". I guess to some people having smelly hanes from brad is worth more money than having the boxers I'm wearing right now, but that's no system to build an economy on.
And these rings aren't hard to obtain, eh? Try getting down to the depths of Sol B and buying the imbue fire opal spell off Zordak.
I know I'm not going to change anything, but I like to try.
Olurin Spelweaver
Virtute et Armis
7th Hammer.
Oh and by the way....
"The truth is remarkably malleable. It can be shaped to fit any man's beliefs."
That's the most illogical, immoral and down right awful thing I've ever read. I'm not going to get into philosophy on a chat board for a video game, but Jeebus. Try taking a math class some time and see if you can make 2+2=5 by believing it.
Well, I'm off to change the truth to fit my belief that I'm a rock star. See you guys on tour.
Edited, Tue May 14 07:16:54 2002
Go study Quantum Physics Olorun and you will discover that 2+2 does indeed equal five if you wish it so.
Daxil Solshok
47 wiz Xegony
Daxil Solshok
47 wiz Xegony
[url=www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=688483]Daxil Solshok[/url]
Arcanist - EQ 1 (retired)
Ernie
Ogre Guardian - EQ 2
Arcanist - EQ 1 (retired)
Ernie
Ogre Guardian - EQ 2
18 posts
Actually, using calculs, i can make 1+1=0, hehe, just to show you that math is as illogical as the rest of the world
Xxaiver Spellweaver
Enchanter of Brell Serilis Server (Cazic Thule)
Twiddledumb
Hunter of Nathrizim
Enchanter of Brell Serilis Server (Cazic Thule)
Twiddledumb
Hunter of Nathrizim
5 posts
Hmmm, let me pull up my transcripts real fast... Yeah I thought so. Computer Engineering/Math double major and a minor in Physics. This is totally off topic (I don't even sell these rings anymore), but while I'm on this thread I thought I might as well put up another post.
2+2 does NOT equal 5 even in Quantum Mechanics. Quantum is all about probability waves. You may have a system where there're a 90% chance of having 2 particles in an infinite potential well and then you add 2 more particles in but when you open the lid of the box (so to speak) you find 5 particles inside. This doesn't mean that 2+2=5, it means that the odds were beaten and there actually were 3 particles inside the well to begin with. Or an electron tunneled through the lid of the box. Or a pair of virtual particles appeared in the box just as you opened the lid and the one with negative mass was pulled into a spacial dimension beyond our ability to measure. Quantum is a magic act. Just because you see a rabit come out of the hat doesn't mean it appeared out of no where. Mass/energy is always conserved. If a particle spawns out of nowhere with positve energy then there's another particle somewhere that has negative energy. You CANNOT get more out of a system than you put into it. And I'll believe otherwise when you solve the cold fusion equations.
And now onto Calculus... The obvious is that you can't disprove arithmetic with calculus. Calculus is, in essence, a way to do arithmetic on an infinite scale. If arithmetic were false (read subjective, or non-absolute) then calculus would also be false and therefore any proof you make with calculus would be true only by sheer luck. Basically what you said is that math is flawed and I'll use this flawed system to prove that it's flawed. If the system is flawed you can't prove ANYTHING with it. What most likely occured is that somewhere in your "proof" you divided by 0 or multiplied by an infinite. Here's a common "proof" that people think proves math flawed.
Assertion: The only realy number is 0.
Let a be any real number.
Let b be equal to a.
Then
a = b
a*a = a*b.............Multiply both sides by a
a^2 - b^2 = a*b - b^2........Subtract b^2 from both sides
(a+b)(a-b) = b(a-b)..............Factor
a+b = b...............Divide both sides by (a-b)
a = 0...............Subtract b from both sides
And so by this "proof" you can say that a is any real number and that it equals exactly 0, therefore all real numbers equal 0. Well guess what, up there in the step where I divided both sides by (a-b) I actually divided by 0 which of course gives an undifined value. Since a = b, a-b=0 by definition.
I'm not sure how you think you proved that 1+1 = 0 using calculus but I'd bet that you did something along these lines.
Anyway back to the original topic... My whole point was that basing a system of economy on an item's rarity/difficulty to obtain rather than that item's value to a player makes no sense.
Olurin Spelweaver
56 Wizard and memeber of Virtute et Armis
7th Hammer
Edited, Thu Feb 27 05:06:41 2003
2+2 does NOT equal 5 even in Quantum Mechanics. Quantum is all about probability waves. You may have a system where there're a 90% chance of having 2 particles in an infinite potential well and then you add 2 more particles in but when you open the lid of the box (so to speak) you find 5 particles inside. This doesn't mean that 2+2=5, it means that the odds were beaten and there actually were 3 particles inside the well to begin with. Or an electron tunneled through the lid of the box. Or a pair of virtual particles appeared in the box just as you opened the lid and the one with negative mass was pulled into a spacial dimension beyond our ability to measure. Quantum is a magic act. Just because you see a rabit come out of the hat doesn't mean it appeared out of no where. Mass/energy is always conserved. If a particle spawns out of nowhere with positve energy then there's another particle somewhere that has negative energy. You CANNOT get more out of a system than you put into it. And I'll believe otherwise when you solve the cold fusion equations.
And now onto Calculus... The obvious is that you can't disprove arithmetic with calculus. Calculus is, in essence, a way to do arithmetic on an infinite scale. If arithmetic were false (read subjective, or non-absolute) then calculus would also be false and therefore any proof you make with calculus would be true only by sheer luck. Basically what you said is that math is flawed and I'll use this flawed system to prove that it's flawed. If the system is flawed you can't prove ANYTHING with it. What most likely occured is that somewhere in your "proof" you divided by 0 or multiplied by an infinite. Here's a common "proof" that people think proves math flawed.
Assertion: The only realy number is 0.
Let a be any real number.
Let b be equal to a.
Then
a = b
a*a = a*b.............Multiply both sides by a
a^2 - b^2 = a*b - b^2........Subtract b^2 from both sides
(a+b)(a-b) = b(a-b)..............Factor
a+b = b...............Divide both sides by (a-b)
a = 0...............Subtract b from both sides
And so by this "proof" you can say that a is any real number and that it equals exactly 0, therefore all real numbers equal 0. Well guess what, up there in the step where I divided both sides by (a-b) I actually divided by 0 which of course gives an undifined value. Since a = b, a-b=0 by definition.
I'm not sure how you think you proved that 1+1 = 0 using calculus but I'd bet that you did something along these lines.
Anyway back to the original topic... My whole point was that basing a system of economy on an item's rarity/difficulty to obtain rather than that item's value to a player makes no sense.
Olurin Spelweaver
56 Wizard and memeber of Virtute et Armis
7th Hammer
Edited, Thu Feb 27 05:06:41 2003
5 posts
I recently saw a faulty proof which reminded me of this post. Nice to see that everyone else has moved on and no longer cares about this debate anymore, but for anyone new to this thread here's a little bonus.
The integral from -1 to 1 of the equation y = 1. (Or any integral where the area on the positive half of the x axis is the same on the negative half of the x axis.) By the rules of integration, you have to break the integral into 2 parts; -x to 0, and 0 to x.
When you do the integral of y = 1 over the distance of x = -1 to x = 1, you recieve a 0 for a solution.
If you do the integral of y = 1 from x = -1 to x = 0, you recieve 1 for a solution.
If you do the integral of y = 1 from x = 0 to x = 1, the solution is also 1.
I suppose that someone could say that the integral of y = 1 over x = -1 to x = 1 has the solution 0, but is also the sum of the solutions 1 and 1.
By this (insane) logic one might state that 1+1 = 0.
This is incorrect. No where in these inane ramblings does the mathematician come remotely close to what can be considered a rational thought. He is awarded no points for this round. And may God have mercy on his soul.
Olurin Spelweaver
Arcanist
New Members Officer
Virtute et Armis
7th Hammer
The integral from -1 to 1 of the equation y = 1. (Or any integral where the area on the positive half of the x axis is the same on the negative half of the x axis.) By the rules of integration, you have to break the integral into 2 parts; -x to 0, and 0 to x.
When you do the integral of y = 1 over the distance of x = -1 to x = 1, you recieve a 0 for a solution.
If you do the integral of y = 1 from x = -1 to x = 0, you recieve 1 for a solution.
If you do the integral of y = 1 from x = 0 to x = 1, the solution is also 1.
I suppose that someone could say that the integral of y = 1 over x = -1 to x = 1 has the solution 0, but is also the sum of the solutions 1 and 1.
By this (insane) logic one might state that 1+1 = 0.
This is incorrect. No where in these inane ramblings does the mathematician come remotely close to what can be considered a rational thought. He is awarded no points for this round. And may God have mercy on his soul.
Olurin Spelweaver
Arcanist
New Members Officer
Virtute et Armis
7th Hammer
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